Both engines with starter/relay problems

[scopeusa]

I located the MR-1 Solenoid service instructions provided by speedling, brilliant, extremely helpful! If anyone has the time I would be grateful for input. My port motor relay just started to click on the odd occasion but then the motor kicked in. That seemed to stop but shortly after the starboard engine developed the same problem. The problems have now reappeared. I have changed the battery which failed a load test. I checked the new battery with a load tester, and kept it on a maintenance charger. I have bypassed the battery switch by putting all of the eyes on a stainless bolt to no effect. The battery connections are clean and tight. I have checked the safety switches. The starboard motor is now very lazy requiring 5 - 6 attempts to start. The port motor only fails 1 -2 clicks and then operates as normal for a run. I am thinking that its very odd for both of them to play up at almost the same time? The only thing I have not done that would be easy is to run a jumper cable from the negative terminal to a decent ground on each engine. Is there a tips feature on removing the starters from an SX230HO anywhere? They look pretty difficult to get to, they appear to be located under the manifolds, what needs to be removed to get them out? I am definitely not as flexible as I once was! Is it worth just replacing the relays before thinking of the starters? On the island where I live there is effectively no professional help. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Murf'n'surf]

Use you cell phone and take a video of the starter area. I bet you have a lot of corrosion on the starter where the wires hook in. Check your ground wires for corrosion as well.

 

[Bruce]

I would start by checking the condition of the starter wires and grounds. Then I would try changing the solenoids before the starters. I believe the starters can be removed by removing two bolts. I took pictures as @Murf'n'surf suggested when another member was having starter problems.

 

[treeskier]

Are you 100% certain it is the starters? I had a similar issue this summer on 2 occasions. My boat normally starts right up but in these instances it went from clank, clank, clank (what I later diagnosed as the starter bendix only partially engaging the fly wheel) to click, click, click (which I believe was the starter bendix not engaging). I believe this was all due to an intermittent battery issue (low voltage) because I was able to start both motors right up when I connect my lithium ion jumper pack. After the initial start-up the boat was 100% fine the remainder of the day. I added a NoCo Genius battery tender with shore power supplied from our lift and have had no "starter" issues since.

 

[Marvin willis]

Starters are easy to replace but there's a very little chance both are going bad at the same time. I'm with everyone else either bad ground or corrosion. I thought I had a starter going out again this summer but it was just corrosion.

 

[Speedling]

Especially with salt water, check for the corrosion.
Lay down a mirror in there and put your belly (I am 255 lbs so no excuses here) and look down. I also used a drop light off to the side. In this fashion you can see what you are getting at and what it looks like.
Let us know what you find!
And pictures really don't have limits on this more than fantastic site so upload us a few of the areas if you can.

If you DO end up pulling the starter out you can test it on a battery quickly but please be very careful and wear leather gloves or something and use a thicker wire, not some 10 gauge. A quick spin means it's not the starter.

 

[Julian]

Very strange for both starters to act up at the same time....I also think your original thinking is correct...you aren't getting current to them....corrosion would be simple to check for. Your smart phone is your friend...turn on the video recorder and (assuming it can focus close) stick it under the starter to look at the cables.

 

[ChrisM]

+1 on the negative cables, and possible corrosion, poor connections....

 

[subysti]

I also am thinking poor voltage. Recheck the battery connection also make sure to clean the inside of the battery cable connection. I've seen them where it looks clean but there is a film that can lower current enough to cause issues. Low voltage is going to pull more current and then you will kill the selonoids.

 

[scopeusa]

I went to get my heavy jumper cables and was going to clamp the negative to a decent ground point on each engine. Before I tried that I went to restart the engines. Wow no problem both engines fired straight up, period. I tried it several times and they did not miss a shot. I left the boat for a few hours and tried again, no problem. I tried again this morning and this evening, no problem. I think this rules out starters and relays and puts the ball firmly in the dodgy connection arena. The ground cables and terminals have not been touched but are squeaky clean. What I don't understand is why they would both choose to work at the same time without fault. The only common thing to both engines is the battery, which is new, stands up to a load test and the new battery maintainer is registering fully charged when the problem was happening. I am starting to think the boat has a ghost.

 

[Murf'n'surf]

The battery could be the issue. It can have 13-14volts and be "full" but have low amps which will cause issues like you are having.

 

[CrankyGypsy]

check the fuse near the battery for corrosion on the fuse's tabs.

 

[scopeusa]

I would accept that except for the fact that it did the same when a new jumper pack was connected . After that the jumper pack was connected to a diesel SUV with a low battery and it started it. The battery also shows good under a resistive load tester. If the battery was bad it would not have fixed itself, it can surely only be connections. As far as I know the only connections that are common are the battery switch and Pos/Neg terminals. The battery switch was replaced with a temporary stainless bolt, same problem. The cable terminations are clean. The Neg being eyelets to the stud with a stainless nut, the Pos a terminal clamp, the inside being cleaned with a wire brush on a Dremel. If just one engine started working normally it would be one thing, with both fixing themselves at the same time is weird!

 

[scopeusa]

I think that's a 20 amp, both blades are corrosion free I checked it the other day.

 

[Bruce]

I think that's a 20 amp, both blades are corrosion free I checked it the other day.

It is not in the starter circuit.

 

[Julian]

How about a different angle.....might it be a bad or partially pulled kill switch lanyard?

 

[Bruce]

How about a different angle.....might it be a bad or partially pulled kill switch lanyard?

I believe engines turn over with the lanyard pulled but will not start.

The cleanout tray or neutral position switches seem like a better fit to me.

 

[subysti]

Did you actually take the terminals off the battery and clean the inside of them with a good wire brush or sand paper. Also clean the battery terminals the same way. They may look clean but are not. It's happened to me where they look fine but they is still surface corrosion enough to kill the battery amperage available.

 

[Murf'n'surf]

You are correct, the load test would show low amps.

I've seen the copper inside of the wire jacket in poor condition and caused random starting issues. Sounds like you've got to get in there and start taking connections apart to rule things out.

 

[ChrisM]

Are you able to post pictures of the areas you have clear camera access to?