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Humming Noise After Amplifier Install

H2OBoy

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Thanks for all of the feedback. My installer investigated the issue further yesterday and still cannot find the culprit. He did pinpoint it to only happening when using Bluetooth (which is all I ever use). The sound is there with or without any accessories (blower, etc.) on or with the boat running or not. I'm not certain the issue is not coming from my head unit and went unnoticed until adding the amplifier. He is going to install a different amplifier with RCA inputs to see if there is a difference.
 

Julian

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Blowers are the main offenders, I hate them - those things are loud AND basically useless in these boats,
What makes you say they are useless? They move a decent amount of air (which is their only purpose) which helps to suck out any gas fumes...which isn't useless.
 

Julian

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Julian

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Back when engines had carburetors and car engines in boats had open ignitions...

Yes, that's when and why boats were blowing up and blowers became mandatory in boats. And that was a good thing.

Now, fast forward few decades to today.
In your new E-series Yamaha - blowers are nothing more than a holdover from the bygone era of those old boat power plants.

Fuel vapors coming off a fuel injected engine... I don't think that actually exists in FI engines (assuming it's working properly - or you have bigger problems that a blower is not going to solve) and the ignition systems are sealed - you just don't have the vapors and the ignition sources you had before.

Once you start and run - the engines are giant air pumps that move thousand times more air throught he engine comp/bilge than the silly little RULE blower... Which, BTW, hardly moves any air anyway.

I have looked into those issues, a lot, when doing my first ribbon delete (there are still those here who will tell you your boat is going to blow up when you remove the ribbons as those are also flame arrestors :)). I happen to have family who often rides with me and no intention to blow my boat up. So - I researched that topic to death, talked to many people way more knowledgeable; concluded this whole idea of ribbons being needed to arrest flames in a fuel injected engine is... pure baloney.

As a side note:
Yeah, we all heard of jet skis blowing up in smoke. Usually a result of a gross neglect/pools of fuel leaked into the little bilge/etc. - I do not believe the stupid little Rule OEM blower would help much in those cases. Would it?

So yes, I do think those OEM blowers are... useless. And awfully loud. And yes, they are required by law.

If you want a real blower, I think @gmtech had moded one that was 6/12v whisper quiet one that was rated something like 10x the volume of the OEM air moved. I would do that, maybe.

In the meantime - the little OEM thingy does nothing to improve our boating safety.

--
We can agree to disagree on this topic. We've had a number of people with fuel sender leaks and even one tank leak. I will agree that a blower won't help in a tank leak situation...you will go BOOM in that situation. You will have a higher chance of going boom if you have ribbons deleted-but still not very high. But in the situation of a minor fuel sender leak....blowers could prevent a nasty explosion in those cases. Heck, I even had my fume alarm go off once when I was fueling my old boat. I think fumes were blowing back in under the rear side vents into my engine compartment...triggered my fume alarm. Yes blowers are loud....but I'm keeping and using mine....along with a fume detector.
 

adrianp89

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So my noise is all sources but much worse on BT. I think our issue is the same. Does your buzzer stay making a noise as soon as your battery switch is turned on?
 

H2OBoy

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So my noise is all sources but much worse on BT. I think our issue is the same. Does your buzzer stay making a noise as soon as your battery switch is turned on?
Yes. The battery switch makes no difference in the noise.
 

vxooxv

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My hum comes from whatever stays powered on the boat for 2-4 seconds after I turn the key off. I think it's actually via one key or the other I forgot. I hear the slight hum (with my amps powered on) and even when I turn the keys off, it's a hum for 2-3 seconds and then turns off. It's almost as if it gets slightly louder for those couple seconds. Is there something in the boat that powers off a few seconds after the keys are turned off?

I thought it was because I had my LED controller box to the same amp power block. I then ran the controller all the way back to the battery to isolate it. No dice.

I suspect it has something to do with my HU (Fusion) powering down as if my memory serves me the Ignition wire is tapped into a key lead. I gave up the fight.
 

swatski

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So my noise is all sources but much worse on BT. I think our issue is the same. Does your buzzer stay making a noise as soon as your battery switch is turned on?
Does the Bluetooth module and HU have their own independent power supplies/sources?
(I on a hum hunt...) If HU and amps are in the same power/ground path but the BT is not, is that important? How is BT powered in Connext boats? Can't find it in the manual...

--
 

Mainah

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Bluetooth is incorporated in the Polk. I have even recently switched to using Bluetooth instead of USB even though my testing proved USB to be a cleaner source. Bluetooth is just more convenient. I don’t have a hum. I did swap the headunit ground to my helm grounding bar on the 0 awg backbone a while back as I just felt it was a good idea.
 

adrianp89

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As mania said, it is built in. My stator was replaced and while my boat day lasted about 10 minutes yesterday, I didn't notice the hum any longer... but not much testing or listening was done in that regard.
 

motoman006

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Is the low pass filter on

My clarion amp does the same thing with low pass filter

When I switch it to high pass filter it goes away

I think it's somthing with the factory power and ground issue
But I just leave it on high pass filter and don't hear and hiss anymore
 

swatski

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Bluetooth is incorporated in the Polk. I have even recently switched to using Bluetooth instead of USB even though my testing proved USB to be a cleaner source. Bluetooth is just more convenient. I don’t have a hum. I did swap the headunit ground to my helm grounding bar on the 0 awg backbone a while back as I just felt it was a good idea.
Thank you so much! You have guys been incredibly helpful!!!

One last thing (before I get back to crawling behind that helm...). Is the swim deck remote display something to consider as far as potential ground loops, or not worry for now? No idea how it is power-sourced, and again the service manual is of no help.

TIA!!!

--
 

Mainah

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Thank you so much! You have guys been incredibly helpful!!!

One last thing (before I get back to crawling behind that helm...). Is the swim deck remote display something to consider as far as potential ground loops, or not worry for now? No idea how it is power-sourced, and again the service manual is of no help.

TIA!!!

--
You could of course try unplugging the swim deck remote to rule it out.
 

swatski

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swatski

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Guys - including @bigblank69, @Mainah, and @adrianp89 - big thank you for all the advice.
I cleaned up, tightened, and grounded the HU along with all three amps and WS420 to the common big wire direct to battery - no more hum! The hum is gone! I can even run my blowers - and still no hum!!!

Now, I'm not totally out of the woods, yet. Still have some very faint cracking/ticking noise - and it is generated/sensitive to RCAs connecting to my WS420.
Not bad, and I could live with that but given I know the source I'm inclined to try eliminate it. My system would then be AMAZING (for me).

So, those WS420 RCA cables go back under the helm - where I have a lot going on...
upload_2018-8-2_20-19-44.png

It is a short path (WS420 to Amps) but lots of potential interference - I don't know if I can avoid/re-route much, it's a cluster, small space. I also have to split the "cockpit" WS420 output into two amps that power 10 cabin/swim deck speakers (no amp bypass). So....

Are there RCA cables/connectors available that eliminate/reduce noise?

TIA!

--
 

Mainah

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Guys - including @bigblank69, @Mainah, and @adrianp89 - big thank you for all the advice.
I cleaned up, tightened, and grounded the HU along with all three amps and WS420 to the common big wire direct to battery - no more hum! The hum is gone! I can even run my blowers - and still no hum!!!

Now, I'm not totally out of the woods, yet. Still have some very faint cracking/ticking noise - and it is generated/sensitive to RCAs connecting to my WS420.
Not bad, and I could live with that but given I know the source I'm inclined to try eliminate it. My system would then be AMAZING (for me).

So, those WS420 RCA cables go back under the helm - where I have a lot going on...
View attachment 80389

It is a short path (WS420 to Amps) but lots of potential interference - I don't know if I can avoid/re-route much, it's a cluster, small space. I also have to split the "cockpit" WS420 output into two amps that power 10 cabin/swim deck speakers (no amp bypass). So....

Are there RCA cables/connectors available that eliminate/reduce noise?

TIA!

--
I recommend shielded RCAs from yep you guessed it knuknoceptz. The remaining sound could also be from the components themselves like a switching power supply in a Class D amp.
 

swatski

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I recommend shielded RCAs from yep you guessed it knuknoceptz. The remaining sound could also be from the components themselves like a switching power supply in a Class D amp.
Well... Success!!!

I finally got to it. So, after cleaning up the wires/common ground situation installing those Krystal KnuKonceptz RCAs made all the remaining hum/noise/crackling sounds DISAPPEAR!!!
upload_2018-8-9_22-37-45.png
upload_2018-8-9_22-29-6.png
The WS420 connections and under-the-helm interference must have been responsible for the noise.

What a relief... no noise, no hum!! Just great sound (or nothing).

My system would certainly not pass for a top tier, but with 10 Polk DBs (powered by two xc1410 clarions), tower ICON8s (powered with WS HT-2) and a powered Basslink subwoofer - all routed through the WS420 - I would consider it solid.

Sound quality is great, with no hum/noise no matter what other equipment is running (blowers, engine, ballast pumps etc.)
The system is loud, for in-boat listening becomes unbearably loud past about 50% volume (no distortion).

Me thinks this system is in my boat to stay!

Thanks @Mainah et al. for great advice here!

--
 

Dave burke

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I’ve read a few posts on noise issues and came across this one. I wonder if @Mainah, @swatski or others have any ideas on my issue.

I’ve rewired all my speakers using KnuKonceptz wire, moved my amps (2 Polk 4000.4 and 1 Polk 5000.5) behind the helm. I’m using KnuKonceptz 0 AWG power and ground wire from the battery to a distribution block and 4 AWG to the amps. I have a WS420SQ equalizer wired into the power and ground for the Polk HU. @Mainah, I’ve not rerouted the ground from the HU to the distribution block but I think your suggestion is a great one and will do that.

I first tuned one of the 4-channel amps using a voltmeter and a 1kHz sine wave I downloaded from the JL Audio site, connected up my four cabin speakers and they worked like a charm. I then set the HPF and the crossover to 100 Hz.

I then started doing the same thing with my 2nd Polk 4000.4 which will be powering the WetSounds soundbar that came with the boat as well as the swim platform speakers. I started by setting the gains using the voltmeter and then connected the sound bar. It sounds really good although a bit tinny but I’m thinking that’s because I haven’t connected my sub yet.

Here‘s my problem - when I turn the volume right down, I can hear noise coming from the right channel of the soundbar. Left seems fine. Not sure how to describe the noise other than to say it sounds like static or white noise, almost like tape hiss. Loud enough to be annoying.

My first thought was that maybe I’ve got a bad RCA cable so I tried using a different one (they’re all from KnuKonceptz as well). That didn’t solve the problem so I tried disconnecting the RCAs completely. No luck.

I was thinking maybe there’s a problem with the speaker wire I ran to the right channel of the sound bar. To check this, I connected the speaker to the left front channel of the amp and there was no noise. I got a little excited thinking maybe I had somehow reversed the speaker connections so I then connected the left channel of the speaker to the right front channel of the amp and got the noise in the left channel of the soundbar.

I’ve therefore concluded (tentatively) that the problem is not the RCA cables or speaker wires. Nor is it the soundbar. Is it possible there’s a problem with the amp? When I tuned it with the voltmeter, I did this using the right front channel but then checked it in the left front channel and the voltage levels were very similar.

Not sure what else to do. Any ideas? Many thanks.
 
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Mainah

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Perhaps the wire from the right channel is picking up interference from somewhere along its run. Does not have to be direct contact just too close to a magnet, emi source, or unshielded wire. Could also be the ws420 or the amp. Could also be a ground loop only impacting the right channel for some reason.

First I would try getting all the grounds on the distribution block. It that does not fix it I would take a single speaker on a short piece of wire and hook it ip to the offending amp channel holding the speaker in a leather gloved hand. If that solves it then I would shield the wire in key locations where it may be picking up interference. If that is still not it I would use a different input source into the amp to see if truly the amp.

Also there are different grades of rca cables with different shielding from knuknoceptz perhaps just the right channel is too close something else. Could even be on the back of the 420 where something is touching that channel lead.

Good luck.
 
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