Swapped out Thrust Vector XV for Cobrajet fins...opinions

[HybridSS]

I originally had the Thrust Vector XV and those were a definite improvement over stock. But I did not care for the spray under way and actually wanted something that would stay in the water at speed. The 19 foot SX192 is a MESS while under way at any speed. Straight line tracking is terrible in any waves. The TV did not help this issue since they come out of the water at speed.
So since these fins are all fairly cheap I figured I would get the Cobrajet set up and then sell whichever ones I did not use. So today I finally got to go out with the Cobra Jet set up. I am actually not even sure of the model name. You can see the pictures for what kind they are.
I am very very pleased and satisfied with the CJ set up. The steering response at slow speeds IMO is improved over the TV. Reverse seems to be very useful now. And straight line tracking while at speed is massively improved. One additional thing is steering is still good when cutting throttle to idle when at speed as well,
I would say that I may have lost a MPH or two at WOT. I was seeing 47 or 48 last year with the TV. Today I managed 45 to 46 or so most of the day. I can not say that with total certainty though since there are many variables to top speed.
I would also say that the steering wheel is just a bit heavier to turn at speed than before. But I dont find this to be a problem at all, just different.

I still think the Thrust Vectors are an improvement over stock but I will be selling the TV for $50 to whoever wants them. Just PM me.
Here are a few pics. The last pic was the reason for todays trip. We made the maiden trek to the boat slip we just purchased to check the route. 13k lb boat lift will be going in soon. I was able to back into the slip with the CJ set up without issue.

 

[Brent Gaidosh]

I went through the exact same process as you. Your results are exactly the same as mine. I added the fangs also.

 

[Van T]

I get a lot of spray off my thrush vectors ,do you get less spray with the fangs ? I would like to keep the inside of my boat a little more dry while riding around. And throws up that real fine Mist that gets the whole back of the boat and you even wet while you're driving but I do have the fsh center console I don't know if it's much difference from weight distribution being a little different on the boat.

 

[JetBoatPilot]

@Van T you likely have an older version which did not have the spray guard. We will warranty swap your fins if you're having spray issues.

 

[swatski]

I originally had the Thrust Vector XV and those were a definite improvement over stock. But I did not care for the spray under way and actually wanted something that would stay in the water at speed. The 19 foot SX192 is a MESS while under way at any speed. Straight line tracking is terrible in any waves. The TV did not help this issue since they come out of the water at speed.
So since these fins are all fairly cheap I figured I would get the Cobrajet set up and then sell whichever ones I did not use. So today I finally got to go out with the Cobra Jet set up. I am actually not even sure of the model name. You can see the pictures for what kind they are.
I am very very pleased and satisfied with the CJ set up. The steering response at slow speeds IMO is improved over the TV. Reverse seems to be very useful now. And straight line tracking while at speed is massively improved. One additional thing is steering is still good when cutting throttle to idle when at speed as well,
I would say that I may have lost a MPH or two at WOT. I was seeing 47 or 48 last year with the TV. Today I managed 45 to 46 or so most of the day. I can not say that with total certainty though since there are many variables to top speed.
I would also say that the steering wheel is just a bit heavier to turn at speed than before. But I dont find this to be a problem at all, just different.

I still think the Thrust Vectors are an improvement over stock but I will be selling the TV for $50 to whoever wants them. Just PM me.
Here are a few pics. The last pic was the reason for todays trip. We made the maiden trek to the boat slip we just purchased to check the route. 13k lb boat lift will be going in soon. I was able to back into the slip with the CJ set up without issue.

Very informative, albeit unsurprising.

Having used the Cobra Ultimates and Fangs in my 190 (that was before the MEGAs were offered) - I say one can simply not overstate the importance of fins in improved tracking and turning at speed, in normal cruising. The turns become sharp and crisp and the control is simply awesome. But particularly when it comes to water sports - the Cobras simply are a must (in single engine boats).

IMO, one can simply not understand or appreciate the potential for fun and satisfaction in riding these jet boats, especially single engine, without trying the Cobra system.

I think Ulitimates plus Fangs/MEGAs may still have their place/niche - for those who consider wake surfing. I'm not sure which system would be better, Vipers or Ultimates, but that is a discussion only pertinent to those who are willing to load their 190s with 1,000+lbs of ballast and go wake surf. That is not for everyone, lol.

--

 

[Van T]

I surf and load the boat down like to know which ones are the best if anybody's got any input and also if they spray water up

 

[HybridSS]

Other things to consider:
CJ steering is fixed and ridgid. Impact something and you are likely to run into issues.
TV are flexible and retracting so that is a plus. However if you are backed into a cove and they make contact they will bend (ask me how I know). But they are fairly easy to straighten.

As for spray with the CJ- there is still some spray. But it is contained within a very small area near the nozzle. My rear deck stayed dry all day.

 

[spatty99]

I think (most if not all) CJ are NOT rigid, meaning they will give way (spring loaded) if pushed front the front (of the boat).

 

[Augieol65]

Can anyone help clarify the difference in the cobra products? I have seen multiple terms are they all describing the same set up or are there different options available? I have the 212 so twin set up.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

The Ultimate steering is spring loaded . adjustable and selectable meaning you can set them to stay down all the time you can set the exact depth you want them to stay down at or you can set them to rise up at speed and give very little influence in the top end, plus they do not have any cross members spray guards or other bars in place between the fins below the nozzle , this is very important and they are tempered aluminum for effectiveness. So that is one option the vipers are fixed and if you run into a submerged stone wall they are made to bend s there is a thread about this happening on the Connecticut river. and with all the distortion from the impact the owner returned to the boat ramp sent me the bent up unit under my 49 dollar repair or replace warranty and he also purchased a second unit to keep on hand just in case it ever happened again that speaks volumes, he did not want to go without that system . also I fixed the part for a very small amount I think it was around 29 dollars or close to it. I believe this thread is also on the web page if you search for it. here are a few https://jetboaters.net/threads/viper-cobra-jet-steering.14912/
https://jetboaters.net/threads/cobra-jet-viper.13241/
https://jetboaters.net/threads/cobra-jet-steering-viper-system.12942/
https://jetboaters.net/threads/tossing-it-out-there-any-viper-owners.3875/
this was a post from a 19 foot owner that has no rudder after he installed ultimate steering with the fangs. https://jetboaters.net/threads/cobra-jet-steering.13786/#post-239013

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

One more thing on the VIPER N K and NK2 you can even add the mega fangs to it so $159 for the viper unit and $85 extra for the mega fangs if you choose .

 

[Van T]

What do they do
?

 

[Van T]

I would assume they make the steering a little bit more tight like a quad surfboard that holds the rail a little different than a trifin

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

The fangs are mega size so they give even more power steering effect and they are closer to the reverse opening and larger so they add to the reverse influence plus they make the boat carve like it's on rails. But I still can't get them to wash the boat at the end of the day!

 

[FloJet]

Other things to consider:
CJ steering is fixed and ridgid. Impact something and you are likely to run into issues.
TV are flexible and retracting so that is a plus. However if you are backed into a cove and they make contact they will bend (ask me how I know). But they are fairly easy to straighten.

As for spray with the CJ- there is still some spray. But it is contained within a very small area near the nozzle. My rear deck stayed dry all day.

This kinda sounds like a joke here. Lol. Flexible Sounds Cheap for boat parts? First the CJ sit same level as your hull so I doubt you will hit anything. I would bet all my life savings that CJ would last way way longer than TV. I've never heard of anyone bending or damaging their CJ but I have heard otherwise with the TV. That spray issue I keep hearing about just makes it another reason CJ is better IMO. CJ don't spray lol. Just a thought for this post.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Thank you for the kind words I think it is important to focus on accuracy and honestly, anyone can destroy anything if they get the circumstances just right.
Case in point https://jetboaters.net/threads/sank-my-boat.7567/#post-130925

I have had a few people damage their parts and regardless of fault " as I said one viper was damaged on the same river as the post above and probably the same fish trap wall.
But it did not rip off the pump and it got him back to the ramp that was several miles away.
Plus with my free 49 dollar repair or replace warranty he sent me the part and I repaired it for a small fee. plus shipping
I returned it to him very quickly.
The most common Issue I have is people not using thread locking compound on the bottom bolt as instructed, and this issue comes into play a couple times a year.
it is sad because it is so avoidable. And remember this steering is my baby I did it and applied for and received my first patent way back before anyone else around here tried to do it and that is a matter of record in the patent office.#6561858, #6702630, #8425269, and another pending.
I must say that I am quite impressed that for the most part customers honestly admit they did not use the thread locking compound as they were instructed to and I tell them in the install info that failure to do so can cause damage to the parts. This is true even if you removed a nozzle and then reinstalled it without thread locking compound.
I can promise you the same result will happen if people forget to use thread locking compound on the bolt in the bottom of the nozzle during the lateral thruster install, The bolt will fall out from the forces of the jet turning the nozzle, when that happens the nozzle will remain in place and functioning until the operator puts the controls in reverse when they give it some throttle the closed reverse bucket will place a lot of force on the nozzle while it redirects the thrust from the jet causing it to rotate up snapping off the top of the nozzle . It isn't the product it's just the improper installation.
If a steering system was capable of ripping off your nozzle both bolt locations would be broken off and both bolts would still be attached to the inner nozzle.
However if a bolt works loose and falls out due to improper installation, only the part of the nozzle where the bolt was still in place would break and that bolt will still be there .
Now for my pet peeve, The infamous ripping your PUMP off statement is just a ridiculous and reckless lie, so if you ever hear this stuff during a sales pitch from a competitor please let me know immediately, along with stuff like it will void your warranty etc. Pretty sad tactics in my opinion.
I believe if we address the misconceptions openly our customers can make informed decisions as to what best suits their needs. I realize a lot of this has been covered from time to time but as I have come to realize it is similar to a school teacher each year teaching the same lessons to a new group of people ,every year we have new jet boat owners joining us so we need to cover the information once again.

 

[Augieol65]

Sounds Ike cobra is the definitely the way to go. Works for slow speed, at speed and most importantly coming off speed. Seems like an obvious choice for me come spring!

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Can anyone help clarify the difference in the cobra products? I have seen multiple terms are they all describing the same set up or are there different options available? I have the 212 so twin set up.

For your boat and the 24 foot a k boats I build a special model specific system for the twin articulating keel jet boats.
Keep in mind designing steering for jet boats is what I do and started doing it back in 2001 when I purchased a jet boat for my family and hated the steering.
In any case the magnum A K steering system with the mega fangs is the system that @swatski has on his boat. It is adjustable and full time steering. With the second tie rod to balance out your original steering system included with the set. There is plenty of information available here regarding this system . Just do a search on the magnum a k steering. here are a few links
https://jetboaters.net/threads/cobra-jet-steering-l-l-c-showing-you-the-magnum-a-k-steering-system.6093/
https://jetboaters.net/threads/2016-ar240-cobra-fins-magnum-ak-w-fangs-install-and-first-impressions-plus-ez-locks-refresher.11530/page-3#post-224195
https://jetboaters.net/threads/buyers-remorse.13510/page-3#post-237053
https://jetboaters.net/threads/mega-fangs-cobra-ak-power-steering-doughnuts-in-reverse.15877/page-2#post-273377

 

[njmr2fan]

I have the Cobras with Fangs on our 190. My boat was the first boat my FIL ever drove in his life. He told me he thought driving a boat would be much harder. The next day we're driving his neighbors bay boat and he says to the guy how straight and easy it was to drive my jetboat compared to his outboard. Ha!

My 8 yr old son took the wheel while I put up our Navigation light and he kept a nice straight line at no wake speed. I think this speaks volumes for the fins (and my driver training), but mostly the fins.

 

[WTScott]

Great thread and lots of entertainment as usual.

I actually have Cobra's on my 24 and TV's on my FSH 21. I really like the way the 21 performs and handles and did not feel the need for additional help / tracking at speed. I also wanted to try out the thrusters - installed but not tested - and the Cobras are not an option with those. My experience on my FSH 19 (both systems) was better handling with TV's at slow speed but some spray. When I switched to the Cobra's I lost some slow speed ability (guess from the surface area) but had less spray and better handling at speed.

On the 24 foot, the Cobras are great at speed - much improved handling and tracking with skiers and tubes. Not to say it is great, but with the rope on the tower it is definitely acceptable and in spitting range of our old malibu (which had outdrive, rudder and three fins for tracking - different animal). The 24 is very different in handling from the 21 - much less responsive. The slow speed handling with the Cobras is marginal in my experience - a little better but still not great. Backing up control is very little improved and in certain low wind conditions is non-existent. Very much like a v-drive and can be handled with experience and bumping in right direction in forward.

I have hit a log and bent my Cobras resulting in an engine error when the fin blocked the engine from going into reverse. Loaf mode in forward still available and clearable with battery shutdown and restart. I bent the Cobra back in place and back in business.

Bottom line for me is again no perfect solution but lots of fun experimenting with options and playing with the boats. Thrusters could be a game changer - will report back.