The American Dream

[1rjclark]

What do you consider a livable wage? This question CAN NOT be answered with a dollar amount since the cost of living is dependent on location. In my opinion a livable wage is when you earn enough to eat a healthy diet, pay your bills on time, own a car or not( should be a choice), with sacrifice and proper planning save enough to be able to purchase a home, the ability to maintain your house, transportation, and afford decent medical coverage...... sounds like a lot doesn't it? It's not but for many it doesn't even seem obtainable!

 

[BigN8]

Anyone living in America is living the American Dream.. It's what you do with the dream while you are here that make the dream a reality or a nightmare. I often think what if I was born in Ethiopia, Mexico, Somalia,......or any other 3rd world country where there really is no dream, and life itself is truly a struggle.

Just my opinion.....

 

[Zeus2013]

I will say this since this has been in the news recently. Minimum Wage is not a Living Wage. It was not created for people to live off of to support a family or ones self. Increasing it does not solve the problem. There is a much larger problem with our economy.

 

[Julian]

Posting from India, a living wage is relative. The poor is the us would be kings here.

 

[jdonalds]

What do you consider a livable wage? This question CAN NOT be answered with a dollar amount since the cost of living is dependent on location. In my opinion a livable wage is when you earn enough to eat a healthy diet, pay your bills on time, own a car or not( should be a choice), with sacrifice and proper planning save enough to be able to purchase a home, the ability to maintain your house, transportation, and afford decent medical coverage...... sounds like a lot doesn't it? It's not but for many it doesn't even seem obtainable!

Don't forget to put away 10-25% for retirement depending on your age. I'm retired and it makes me sad to hear how little most Americans have saved for their later years. We have Social Security, a pension, and our investment portfolio. We're now living in a less expensive city than when I worked. So we are fine, but things can go wrong to drain your accounts. You need a healthy nest egg.

Most won't have a pension in their retirement. Social Security, even if it is somehow funded by the time you hit retirement, won't support you very well if at all. You really need to invest.

 

[Britboater]

Health is wealth..................


A liveable wage is very dependent on the individual. I live in an area where we have a lot of "Eco warriors" (for the sake of a better label), and they live a very simple existence, they do not work, but also do not claim any state benefit. A few have actually "disappeared" from the governments claws.
But one thing I've noticed, is they are all very healthy, away from any stress, pollution and in general, the rat race. Most of there food is home grown and it amazes me what they can produce.

 

[Ronnie]

I agree with 1rjclark's definition of a livable wage and also that it not only seems but is impossible for many in the US to obtain. However, I'm not sure that a livable wage is the American Dream. Maybe I'm just an overly ambitious and / or greedy guy but I want to do more than just get by.

I'd rather eat what I want not what I need, live debt free rather than be a timely debtor which includes buying a home outright instead of taking out a mortgage on one and spend time and money now to improve and maintain my health instead of use it to try and get healthy after becoming ill. I also need enough to pay for kid's education, take vacations and of course buy discretionary items like boats, quad copters, tvs, cameras, etc.

This is a very timely subject for me since just yesterday one of the VPS At the company I work for announced that he is quitting his job and moving Texas to start a new career, at a lower salary, so that his wife can quit work to spend more time with 5 of their 6 kids (their 6th is already away at college). This is a guy who currently makes more than $250k per year, is eligible for a bonus of up to 35% of his salary, has a vested pension and could get lifetime benefits if he stays a few more years. His announcement yesterday had a lot of my coworkers and Myself scratching our heads wondering if we have our priorities "right". Clearly, his definition of a livable wage is a lot different than mine.

 

[Speedling]

The american dream? Sounds like something immigrants want and talk about until they get here.
Minimum wage? Why is it a discussion? Won't capitalism take care of itself? By raising minim wage we're just devaluing the dollar. So people that make 7 bucks an hour go up to 10. Great. But then people that make 25 go up to 30 and those that make 55 go up to 70. It's all delayed a year or two, but that's how it works. If everyone was millionaires, then a Ford fiesta would cost half a million.
I too agree that hard work should pay off. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. I work two jobs to afford a Yamaha. I work for my dreams, I don't need someone telling me what my value is or how much I should make. Besides, isn't that communism?

 

[Wayloncle]

I've been searching for a story I read On a sign at a sandwich shop the other day but I couldn't find it, so I will summarize it. The story made me realize this is how I've always felt...

A business man went to Mexico and saw a local fisherman with a few Tuna in his boat, he asked why the man didn't catch more and what he did with his extra time. The fisherman said he caught just enough to support his family so he could spend time with his kids and wife, had time for church, and spend time with his elderly parents. The business man told him he could catch more fish, buy a bigger boat to catch even more then, he could hire people to run more boats and turn it into a big business, move to the states and make millions. He told the fisherman he could do all this in 20-25 years and then he could retire and spend his days fishing, hangout with his wife and kids, spend time at church.....

 

[1rjclark]

My American dream was those basics that I describe in what a livable wage would cover. I'm not an immigrant, born in The peoples republic of Berkeley and raised in Oakland. Having achieved that,despite some challenges( we've all had them) I feel truly blessed with all the extra stuff that I have been able to earn.

 

[Speedling]

I guess when you think about it, the American dream, is simply the opportunity.

 

[007]

I guess when you think about it, the American dream, is simply the opportunity.

I agree. We are not a caste or class system. Take you chances, work hard, endevour to get what you desire. That to me is the American Dream is.

 

[0627Devildog]

The American dream is the promise of opportunity. Opportunity to better ones station in life with hard (and smart) work. Growing up we barely had 2 nickels to rub together. . . . . But a strong work ethic was instilled in me at a young age.

I went from barely having a pot to piss in to being able to build a lakefront vacation retreat in addition to my full time residence. Many sacrifices were made, but the reward is grand.

 

[redthumper9]

I've been searching for a story I read On a sign at a sandwich shop the other day but I couldn't find it, so I will summarize it. The story made me realize this is how I've always felt...

A business man went to Mexico and saw a local fisherman with a few Tuna in his boat, he asked why the man didn't catch more and what he did with his extra time. The fisherman said he caught just enough to support his family so he could spend time with his kids and wife, had time for church, and spend time with his elderly parents. The business man told him he could catch more fish, buy a bigger boat to catch even more then, he could hire people to run more boats and turn it into a big business, move to the states and make millions. He told the fisherman he could do all this in 20-25 years and then he could retire and spend his days fishing, hangout with his wife and kids, spend time at church.....

Amazing you posted this....I was thinking of the same thing. You saw this in Jimmy John's.

 

[redthumper9]

Here is the whole story:

An American investment banker was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them.

The Mexican replied, “only a little while. The American then asked why didn’t he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family’s immediate needs. The American then asked, “but what do you do with the rest of your time?”

The Mexican fisherman said, “I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siestas with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine, and play guitar with my amigos. I have a full and busy life.” The American scoffed, “I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat. With the proceeds from the bigger boat, you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing, and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually New York City, where you will run your expanding enterprise.”

The Mexican fisherman asked, “But, how long will this all take?”

To which the American replied, “15 – 20 years.”

“But what then?” Asked the Mexican.

The American laughed and said, “That’s the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions!”

“Millions – then what?”

The American said, “Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siestas with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos.”

 

[Wayloncle]

That's it! I guess I added what was crossing my mind when I read it putting myself in the fisherman's spot...

 

[GiddYupJoe]

This is an interesting thread as a old friend of mine and I talk about this all the time. I am 33 years old and worked my previous career from sophomore year in college until I was 30. At 30 my son was 1 year old and my wife and I made what I believe to be a life changing decision. At my previous job I was set to start posting for sales manager positions all over the country to continue my movement up the proverbial ladder. I have strong roots in Dayton and really had no desire to move, I also worked a lot of hours and carried a good amount of stress; however, the money was great. I decided to quit my job that I worked over 10 years at and become a civil servant for the government. I took a rather large pay cut and had to start over at the bottom as a trainee in pool of 23-28 year olds. I made this decision because it was more important for our family to have some stability and we wanted to spend more time together. For the first time in my life I realized that the end goal was not how much money I could make but rather how I spent my time. Please do not get me wrong, money is important and is a direct result of hard work, and we are not doing to bad. For my family and I, the extra time we get to spend together was a tradeoff for making a lot of money vs being comfortable.
I believe this falls right in line with what @Ronnie was talking about in his post. As I mentioned above the "old" friend that I used to have this discussion with, is no longer a friend of mine. Long story short, he believed that I was giving up and not working towards my full potential in life, work wise. We could not see eye to eye when it came to work/life balance and our views on family. I am living my American Dream!

 

[1rjclark]

Great responses! Thanks