GFCI Outlet dead....electrician input????

[WREKS]

@Julian The Lutron Caseta may be interfering with GFCI. Have you tried putting old switch back in to see if normal operation is restored at the GFCI?

 

[906Tony]

Hey Julian, as an Electrician regardless of what happened I would definitely pull the non working gfci’s out and check power To them for starters. Other factors that may be overlooked and coincidental are the age and manufacturer of the gfci outlets. Sometimes I see stuff like this where you may not have known that one was already bad then the other one quit also. I spend a lot of time troubleshooting and I’ve seen a lot of strange coincidences. Btw I love Lutron casetta, especially with the app and smart bridge. Good luck!

 

[Julian]

Hey Julian, as an Electrician regardless of what happened I would definitely pull the non working gfci’s out and check power To them for starters. Other factors that may be overlooked and coincidental are the age and manufacturer of the gfci outlets. Sometimes I see stuff like this where you may not have known that one was already bad then the other one quit also. I spend a lot of time troubleshooting and I’ve seen a lot of strange coincidences. Btw I love Lutron casetta, especially with the app and smart bridge. Good luck!

Do you think there is any way that a caseta switch installed on my 3rd floor would impact my GFCI in the kitchen?

I too love the Lutron Caseta system. I have 65 installed and am just about done (which is why I was putting them in on the 3rd floor).

 

[HangOutdoors]

@Julian, Maybe. I just remodeled our kitchen completely down to the studs and found wiring that went from kitchen receptacle, to upstairs bathroom to hallway and another one in the kitchen up to a light switch for the lights in one of the kids bedroom. What a freaking mess. I have done plenty of wiring and never saw anything like it.

IF they are one the same circuit and there is an issue or voltage issue than it could be a problem.

I ended up ripping all the wiring from the kitchen and running all new kitchen dedicated circuits and some home runs up to the second floor, PITA.

What I would do, if I were you and what I believe someone else suggested, is to pull out the gfci and get a wire tester right on the wires supplying both of those GFCI receptacles. This will be quick and easy and will let you know if the issue is further somewhere else on the circuits. IF you have power than just replace the GFCI's and you should be all set. If not then there is something a miss with the circuit somewhere.

I would bet dollars to doughnuts that it is the GFCI's themselves.

 

[906Tony]

Do you think there is any way that a caseta switch installed on my 3rd floor would impact my GFCI in the kitchen?

I too love the Lutron Caseta system. I have 65 installed and am just about done (which is why I was putting them in on the 3rd floor).

I would say it is possible,though very unlikely. If you haven’t already, try putting the regular switch back in and see what happens. However if the one gfci won’t reset and it has power then it needs to be replaced.

 

[Julian]

I pulled both GFCIs that are unresponsive and wont reset (actually one is blown, one is unreponsive). Neither have power to them as far as I can tell (voltage tester applies between all the wires....nothing lights up). So this means (as far as I know)...that something down the line is blown and stopping power from getting to these two. I just cant find that "something"....and have NO CLUE how I would find it.....

 

[906Tony]

I pulled both GFCIs that are unresponsive and wont reset (actually one is blown, one is unreponsive). Neither have power to them as far as I can tell (voltage tester applies between all the wires....nothing lights up). So this means (as far as I know)...that something down the line is blown and stopping power from getting to these two. I just cant find that "something"....and have NO CLUE how I would find it.....

If you just turned breakers off and didn’t purposely “trip”one by shorting then the most obvious to me would be to go back to the panel and check everyone for tightness and power output. Sometimes when you Short circuit or put a heavy load on a Circuit with a weak point (bad connection) it will open at that point. The trick is finding that point.

 

[zipper]

I pulled both GFCIs that are unresponsive and wont reset (actually one is blown, one is unreponsive). Neither have power to them as far as I can tell (voltage tester applies between all the wires....nothing lights up). So this means (as far as I know)...that something down the line is blown and stopping power from getting to these two. I just cant find that "something"....and have NO CLUE how I would find it.....

It sounds like a feed wire to that circuit, both gfci's, has pulled out of a wire nut connection at a j-box or switch box or another outlet in the area.

 

[Julian]

If you just turned breakers off and didn’t purposely “trip”one by shorting then the most obvious to me would be to go back to the panel and check everyone for tightness and power output. Sometimes when you Short circuit or put a heavy load on a Circuit with a weak point (bad connection) it will open at that point. The trick is finding that point.

Have gone back to that panel multiple times! Part of the circuit is live part is not.....(I'm 95% certain the porch lights are on the same ciruit and they come on).

 

[Julian]

So...if I wanted to try and trace the wires back to where the voltage stops....what tool do I need to accomplish this and is it vastly cheaper than the electrician I've called (who is on vacation until after t-giving)? I'm envisioning a way to trace the dead wires under the house back to where they are no longer dead.....

 

[906Tony]

Have gone back to that panel multiple times! Part of the circuit is live part is not.....(I'm 95% certain the porch lights are on the same ciruit and they come on).

Yeah sounds like your gonna have to do dig a little deeper on this one, it’s kinda tricky for me without actually be there scoping things out. Good luck

 

[906Tony]

So...if I wanted to try and trace the wires back to where the voltage stops....what tool do I need to accomplish this and is it vastly cheaper than the electrician I've called (who is on vacation until after t-giving)? I'm envisioning a way to trace the dead wires under the house back to where they are no longer dead.....

For a quick check use a non contact tick tracer, then use a multimeter for actual voltage check. Klein or ideal make decent little tracers

 

[Julian]

For a quick check use a non contact tick tracer, then use a multimeter for actual voltage check. Klein or ideal make decent little tracers

Don't know how I've lived without one of these! I'll be at home depot today to get one!!!!

 

[zipper]

Have gone back to that panel multiple times! Part of the circuit is live part is not.....(I'm 95% certain the porch lights are on the same ciruit and they come on).

I am not going to guess how the PO wired the house. You can buy volt ohm meters for cheap. You can measure AC/DC voltage as well as continuity of a wire/circuit. Some, more expensive may have the ability to measure current draw on the line. As said above, hard to diagnose from Vermont, but the key is finding the feed wire and tracing it back. I have wired my last three houses that I have lived in, the most recent for 19 years. All still standing. I developed a system for pulling/placing wires thru the strain relief on the boxes. My line sides always come in from the bottom and the load lines exit the top. Makes it easier to diagnose. I am exhausting my suggestions other than start tracing lines with a volt meter. BTW, you can use it to diagnose battery/conductivity issues on your boat too, if they occur.

 

[zipper]

There is a way to backfeed that circuit with the bare wire ends of the feed wire and an extension cord from another circuit. As long as everything on the testing circuit is off at the breaker. Energize that feed wire and see what comes on up the line. If nothing you have an open circuit somewhere, but you know that already, just not where. That is something I would do in person but not something I would recommend doing, from afar, unless you know what you are doing.

 

[Dean P]

@Julian , I had a similar situation where the fuse tripped in the panel and had a hell of a time trying to find the culprit. After checking every wall switch and plug (on that circuit), it ended up being my ceiling fan (hard wired to a wall switch) that died. These guys run 24-7 all year down here.

 

[WREKS]

@Julian I do not think it has been mentioned yet but if you are tooling up and do not already have one, this device is very handy.

 

[Julian]

OK...been to HD and back. Am tooled up....and all I've been able to do is:

1) Confirm the breaker is not bad (have current at the breaker)
2) Confirm again that I have no current at either of these GFCIs (also was told at HD that there shouldn't be two GFCIs on the same
3) Confirmed that half the lights on my porch are out, the other half are not (and there is no power at the switches)
4) Tried to trace the wires under the house....found the dead line.....it disapears into the wall.....

Going to go and look to see if there is a GFCI outlet in the garage on a wall with shelves covering it (pretty sure the answer is no...but this is bugging the F out of me!)

 

[906Tony]

OK...been to HD and back. Am tooled up....and all I've been able to do is:

1) Confirm the breaker is not bad (have current at the breaker)
2) Confirm again that I have no current at either of these GFCIs (also was told at HD that there shouldn't be two GFCIs on the same
3) Confirmed that half the lights on my porch are out, the other half are not (and there is no power at the switches)
4) Tried to trace the wires under the house....found the dead line.....it disapears into the wall.....

Going to go and look to see if there is a GFCI outlet in the garage on a wall with shelves covering it (pretty sure the answer is no...but this is bugging the F out of me!)

Sounds like quite the chase your on now. When they go into the wall I usually start opening things up in that viciny like outlets near by. Sounds like your moving in the right direction.

 

[WREKS]

Did the recent flooding in NC affect you? Also, having an Open Neutral or disconncected neutral can also be a problem. There has to be a return path for the current. There can be power to a light, but if the return path (neutral, (white wire)) is diconnected, the light will not work.