Problems with battery drain on my 242X

[haknslash]

Yea I hope they can get it figured out and back to you asap.

I wonder if the terminals or voice coils are touching on the speaker that crackled and smoked? Can you pull it to check? That would certainly cause an issue for both the speaker and the amp. I don't blame you wanted to be done with it at this point, especially on Father's Day of all times.

 

[Kane]

@Julian, So I had a thought...how about if you disconnected the small ground wire that I believe goes to the Solar Panels...that could take the Solar Panel out of the loop. After looking at your Battery pics, that wire is currently disconnected in my boat. I'll connect that when I go up and see if anything bad happens.
I can say my Stereo works as it should, with the exception of the Humm I have when there isn't a source connected.

I guess we'll have to figure these damn things out together as our Dealers know as much as we do...

 

[Julian]

@Julian, So I had a thought...how about if you disconnected the small ground wire that I believe goes to the Solar Panels...that could take the Solar Panel out of the loop. After looking at your Battery pics, that wire is currently disconnected in my boat. I'll connect that when I go up and see if anything bad happens.
I can say my Stereo works as it should, with the exception of the Humm I have when there isn't a source connected.

I guess we'll have to figure these damn things out together as our Dealers know as much as we do...

It was interesting that the little wire with the label on it saying "connect to common ground" was the only wire that DIDN'T cause the Wetsounds bar to Buzz.

 

[Kane]

Hmmm!

 

[Kane]

Just found a thread on that little black wire...this is NOT to the Solar Panels but to the batteries to allow the house battery to charge. I love this forum but I think I'm cross eyed from over-reading!!!

 

[Julian]

Just found a thread on that little black wire...this is NOT to the Solar Panels but to the batteries to allow the house battery to charge. I love this forum but I think I'm cross eyed from over-reading!!!

Yeah...just saw that thread (which I've read before) and forgot that is was the ground for the DVSR....good to know.

 

[Julian]

Here is a question....why would the Polk amps be connected directly to the batteries and not to the "far side" of the house battery switch? Seems to me like that is a bad way to wire this boat? Thoughts?

 

[Britboater]

I don't have the sounds system your boat has or the solar panels but I do have the one battery discharging. I also noticed its obviously not getting any charge, I'm not with my boat but I will be reading your thread in depth because this is a flaw with Yamaha's dual battery system and it needs fixing.

 

[Julian]

I don't have the sounds system your boat has or the solar panels but I do have the one battery discharging. I also noticed its obviously not getting any charge, I'm not with my boat but I will be reading your thread in depth because this is a flaw with Yamaha's dual battery system and it needs fixing.

When I wired up my dual battery system on my old boat there was one + cable from the battery to the switch, and everything else + was on the other side of the switch EXCEPT one line to the radio for memory presets which I connected to the house battery. So the worst case was a dead house battery.

 

[buckbuck]

Did you verify that the Fluke 78 was capable of reading amperage on a known circuit? For it to read 0.000 would lead me to believe it (the Fluke) has a blown fuse as you typically would see 1-3 thousands of an amp when connected. That is a good meter and it has an internal fuse that protects it from high current flows.

My hope is a certain CEO, of a certain boat manufacturer, would call a meeting tomorrow morning of all engineering and production managers. No doughnuts being served. With a scowl on his face inform them to find the problem and fix it so their $72,000 flagship does not invite ridicule.

 

[Julian]

@buckbuck the boat is going to the dealer in the morning. I think I've done enough of the leg work to help them narrow it down and find the bad cables pretty quickly.

Still wondering why they would wire the amps directly to the batteries....

 

[buckbuck]

It will be interesting to see what the wire schematics show on these boats. I hope your on the water this weekend.

 

[Julian]

Saturday we have an all day 8 hour caneoing trip down the cape fear river, and Sunday will be a recovering day! But hope I can pick up the boat on Friday....so I can go out for a little while on Sunday...

 

[Mainah]

@ Julian - Just happened to read this thread all the way through. I do preface this a lot and with obvious reason but here it goes again ... this is my over the internet using the information I have read and as I understood it theory. There are a few keys things that when put together lead me to believe a wiring issue (possibly in the tower wiring or connections for it) may have caused your amp to fail on top of the battery drain issue. The items I am honing in on are that the tower bar crackles even when power to the amps is disconnected and then when the bar is disconnected that the bow speaker smoked. My post is long but I think worth the read for you and anyone with wiring issues.

First and most important part of my theory is there is no way for a speaker to make sound without either current being applied or EMI. Lets rule out EMI given the other observations. During operation speakers normally receive AC current from an amp and the hissing sound you sometimes hear when the source is turned off but the amps are on is current passing through the speakers. If the speaker is receiving current from something other than amp sending out specific AC current then it is effectively acting as a heat sink. When you disconnected the wire at the speaker bar and ran the amps the current which could have been AC or DC was still present in the wires that are intended for the speaker bar and therefore the current was back feeding into the amp through the speaker terminals on the amp at that point. This also may have led to the bow speaker receiving too much or the wrong kind of current from the amp and its onboard crossover melting down. This could also be the cause of one of the channels on the amp not working when you picked it up in that it was already damaged from the mis-wiring or shorting somewhere. Take a look at the crossover on the back of the speaker that is smoked. If it is melted or deformed in any way this is most likely because of too much current or the wrong kind of current. Too much current can also damage wiring.

Now why would there be current with the battery switch off? I can say there is a small red jumper wire built into my stock battery cables that jumps the power over the battery switch to the cable on the other side. It is barley visible where the wire looms ends on each wire at the battery switches and I assume it is for some kind of memory keep alive. For the e/x series boat there are also solar panels and a solar panel charge controller and I don't know how that this wired in. Suffice it to say I can see how there would be a drain if something was wired wrong or there is a short down stream of the batteries.

The good news is that amps with built in fuses that are wired directly to the battery and that close to the battery are fine as long as the turn on wire to the HU is wired correctly. Not how I or others may do it but it should be fine. Now for the worst case doom and gloom. If my theory is right then a lot of things could be damaged. Wiring could be overheated/melted, the sound bar and other speakers could be damaged, wherever the current is coming from could be damaged, your start battery going down to near zero volts certainly means its lifespan and charge capacity were impacted, obviously the amp, and maybe more I am not thinking of right now.

I really hope my theory is wrong and the dealer pinpoints an issue without a shred of doubt that is an easy fix with no other damage being possible. I would push too have all of the above things I mentioned checked out and possibly replaced depending on what is found out. Again my basis for that is the sound bar receiving current it should not have (sound/crackling with the amp power wires disconnected) which effectively turned it into a heat sink and then the bow speaker getting to much current and smoking is indicative that other things could be damaged. In that case I would most certainly want the speaker and tower wiring visually inspected along its entire length even if it had to be removed from the hull/tower that the loom taken off. Fire hazards are less than ideal in general and on a boat they pose additional dangers.

Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[Julian]

@Mainah I agree with our assessment! In fact, I got up early to take the boat to the dealer and when I arrived at the boat, for the first time the starter battery was not dead-and the only thing different was I had left the wet sounds soundbar unplugged. So it is the cause for the power drain. Now, what it is crossed with is what I've been wondering, and you and I have similar thoughts. Besides speaker wires, there are only 3 other wires running into/out of the tower:
1) Solar panel power feed
2) Anchor light
3) LED lights

Since I've not turned on either of #2 or 3 I'm thinking unlikely they have anything to do with it, but the solar panels will have power running through them all the time the sun is out or are under any bright lights. I also assume the solar panels are connected to both the start and house battery (which I knew how). I also wondered if the sound bar was made to go in golf carts/cars and use a frame ground, which could mean that if the short is into the tower metal, it could impact the speaker through the tower itself? Which might explain why others have said their sound bar hums....?

I agree that no matter what, there is lots of possible collateral damage due to this short. Discharging that battery completely multiple times probably did it no good. Smoking speaker is probably smoked!

 

[Gym]

I agree that no matter what, there is lots of possible collateral damage due to this short. Discharging that battery completely multiple times probably did it no good. Smoking speaker is probably smoked!

Also...where there's smoke, there could be a fire.

 

[Danielmailin]

@Julian you were pretty close in diagnosing the battery drain, you had the amp meter connected correctly, but the Amp fuse was blown, that us why you were reading 0.00 A. (I see this all the time in my field, technicians blow the fuse all the time by not properly connecting them)

If the dealer does not find your battery drain, get yourself a multimeter from Walmart or Sears for $30 with DC 10 Amp meter, due the same set up and measure in milliampms how much drain you have.

Then start by disconnecting one fuese at a time (starting with any assesory fuse, radio) until you see the battery drain drop.
That will show you what circuit is creating the drain.
Then disconnect any component fed by that fuse until you have identified the component causing the drain.

This is what the dealer should do and it should them less than an hour to diagnose it.

Let me know what you find.

 

[Julian]

Got the boat back on Saturday (skipped the canoeing trip) and the stereo now works and the battery drain is solved! WOOT!

Turns out the amps wiring harness was wired wrong and a power wire was crossed with a speaker wire. The cabin speakers and the wetsounds bar are wired on the same channel (something I'll probably change later) and it was this AND the bow speakers that had cross connected wires. Took them a long time on the phone with Yamaha to straighten it all out.

The 6 channel amp still has a fried channel, and is still on back order. Also, the bow speakers were damaged by the wiring issue and are also on order. When the speakers and amp come in I'll take her back one more time and have a completely functioning stereo. But the main part of the system is rocking now!

 

[ripler]

Got the boat back on Saturday (skipped the canoeing trip) and the stereo now works and the battery drain is solved! WOOT!

Turns out the amps wiring harness was wired wrong and a power wire was crossed with a speaker wire. The cabin speakers and the wetsounds bar are wired on the same channel (something I'll probably change later) and it was this AND the bow speakers that had cross connected wires. Took them a long time on the phone with Yamaha to straighten it all out.

The 6 channel amp still has a fried channel, and is still on back order. Also, the bow speakers were damaged by the wiring issue and are also on order. When the speakers and amp come in I'll take her back one more time and have a completely functioning stereo. But the main part of the system is rocking now!

This says a lot about Yamaha's quality control. The problem should have been caught immediately.

 

[OperationROL]

Got the boat back on Saturday (skipped the canoeing trip) and the stereo now works and the battery drain is solved! WOOT!

Turns out the amps wiring harness was wired wrong and a power wire was crossed with a speaker wire. The cabin speakers and the wetsounds bar are wired on the same channel (something I'll probably change later) and it was this AND the bow speakers that had cross connected wires. Took them a long time on the phone with Yamaha to straighten it all out.

The 6 channel amp still has a fried channel, and is still on back order. Also, the bow speakers were damaged by the wiring issue and are also on order. When the speakers and amp come in I'll take her back one more time and have a completely functioning stereo. But the main part of the system is rocking now!

Great news @Julian. Having issues like that just weigh on your mind. Even though it is not all done yet, I bet you are relieved.