Foil Boarding - Loyal to the Foil

[J-RAD]

@J-RAD any chance of a group buy this spring???

It partly depends on availability at this point. They have been out of stock since August of '21. I think right now they're just doing the best they can to try to fulfill dealer inventory orders. I was told they would have stock as of Jan, but I think they immediately went to fulfill dealer orders. I have have a couple on reserve for our inventory set for delivery the first of May. If there's a strong interest prior, I could add more to our pre-order. At the very least I can offer group buy pricing on those pre-book deals. If this interests you (or anyone else), let me know and I can shoot you a DM with more info.

 

[AZMark]

I've been looking for a foil sock/bag that covers the board with the mast on for quite a while now since its so friggin' hot and sunny here. Slingshot has been out of stock for a long time and I was having trouble finding other affordable options.

Just found these from Manera on MACKiteboards and ordered one for $89.00. Its padded and reflective on one side and seems like it will work great either just laying around the boat/beach and also to protect the board in a surf rack.

Boardbags, Foilbags and Travel bags - Kitesurf, surf, foil. - Manera - EN

All boardbags, Foilbags and Travelbags for travel with kitesurf, surf, foil.

www.manera.com

It's supposedly in stock so I'll update once I get it and use it some.

I realize this doesn't support @J-RAD or others on the forum who may sell these products and I'm not thrilled about that, but with the limited stock of certain brands I can't wait forever.

 

[anmut]

Nice thread bump, very timely. Just picked up a "SLINGSHOT HOVER GLIDE FOIL WAKE V3" package from J-Rad that's due to arrive on Friday. Prepare for lots of good wipeout vids.

 

[AZMark]

Nice thread bump, very timely. Just picked up a "SLINGSHOT HOVER GLIDE FOIL WAKE V3" package from J-Rad that's due to arrive on Friday. Prepare for lots of good wipeout vids.

That’s what I’ve got. It’s awesome.

Bring a big screwdriver with you, the mast screws are probably a #4 and I’ve had a helluva time getting the board back apart with a stubby screwdriver before.

 

[anmut]

That’s what I’ve got. It’s awesome.

Bring a big screwdriver with you, the mast screws are probably a #4 and I’ve had a helluva time getting the board back apart with a stubby screwdriver before.

Are you using the tow clip and where do you have your mast set at?

 

[AZMark]

Are you using the tow clip and where do you have your mast set at?

Full disclosure, I’m pretty good on boards in general but haven’t ridden the foil a whole lot yet. Got the board before covid & a baby so it’s been tough to get out & also have a spotter.

I have not used the clip yet. Doesn’t seem necessary for getting up or general riding.

I watched slingshots online tutorial videos and so I started with the mast all the way back based on their recommendation. I think that is too far back and have moved it up maybe 1/4-1/3 of the way now, which is more controllable. When it’s all the way back it’s slower to rise but I felt like I had to make exaggerated moves and that didn’t feel right to me.

 

[Nakk]

I watched slingshots online tutorial videos and so I started with the mast all the way back based on their recommendation. I think that is too far back and have moved it up maybe 1/4-1/3 of the way now, which is more controllable. When it’s all the way back it’s slower to rise but I felt like I had to make exaggerated moves and that didn’t feel right to me.

Yep, all the way back is generally a good place for your first time on a foil. As soon as you're comfortable you want to start bringing it forward. (Depending on your setup. My foil requires the mast to be full aft.) To find the perfect spot, your weight should be evenly split between your feet when you're standing in your preferred position on the board while cruising straight and level. Some advanced riders do prefer to keep a little extra back foot pressure.

 

[AZMark]

Anybody see this Zuckerberg video? He’s not bad!

 

[Nakk]

Anybody see this Zuckerberg video? He’s not bad!

It's funny how the press almost always seems to get their facts wrong. Every report I've seen on this claims he's riding an "Electric Hydrofoil." While Zuckerberg has been seen on a lift eFoil, that board in the video is a non powered Lift foil for kite foiling or wake foiling.

It's interesting to me that he's using straps. First, it's a bad idea and can get you hurt. Foot hooks or "half straps" give all the advantage of straps without the safety drawbacks. I do get it for foil racing, but those straps aren't set up for racing. Second, I wonder why he's using them at all? They really don't help much if you're wake foiling, and I've not heard of him kiting?

 

[J-RAD]

Anybody see this Zuckerberg video? He’s not bad!

View attachment 155935

I saw it, but missed that it was Zuckerberg.

 

[J-RAD]

I've been looking for a foil sock/bag that covers the board with the mast on for quite a while now since its so friggin' hot and sunny here. Slingshot has been out of stock for a long time and I was having trouble finding other affordable options.

Just found these from Manera on MACKiteboards and ordered one for $89.00. Its padded and reflective on one side and seems like it will work great either just laying around the boat/beach and also to protect the board in a surf rack.

Boardbags, Foilbags and Travel bags - Kitesurf, surf, foil. - Manera - EN

All boardbags, Foilbags and Travelbags for travel with kitesurf, surf, foil.

www.manera.com

It's supposedly in stock so I'll update once I get it and use it some.

I realize this doesn't support @J-RAD or others on the forum who may sell these products and I'm not thrilled about that, but with the limited stock of certain brands I can't wait forever.



View attachment 155429

No worries at all! Normally we can dropship those types of things from Slingshot and Ride Engine. Kinda hard to do when it's all out of stock... Desperate times!

Here's what I've been doing. Just a O'Brien surf sock. It's just big enough and stretches enough to wrap around and cinch on the mast.

 

[anmut]

Anybody see this Zuckerberg video? He’s not bad!

View attachment 155935

I was impressed - but then I thought, Zuck just gave foiling a bad name.

 

[anmut]

It's funny how the press almost always seems to get their facts wrong. Every report I've seen on this claims he's riding an "Electric Hydrofoil." While Zuckerberg has been seen on a lift eFoil, that board in the video is a non powered Lift foil for kite foiling or wake foiling.

It's interesting to me that he's using straps. First, it's a bad idea and can get you hurt. Foot hooks or "half straps" give all the advantage of straps without the safety drawbacks. I do get it for foil racing, but those straps aren't set up for racing. Second, I wonder why he's using them at all? They really don't help much if you're wake foiling, and I've not heard of him kiting?

Yeah, SO many news agencies got it wrong with this - it's obvious that he's pumping the board off the wake, so not an e-foil. Straps look make it look like a kite foil maybe? And agree, unless he's just that damn good, that straps make an injury pretty damn sure when learning.

 

[anmut]

Thanks to @J-RAD , I received my Slingshot on Friday night as promised! First thing to note, these aren't plug and play devices - there's assembly required, complete with grease and plumbers tape - LOL!

Day 1 - Saturday:
I had watched a lot of YouTube "how-to's" previously so I was anxious to get out and try it. As advised from videos, I started with a wakeboard rope at it's shortest length and locked the speed in at 10.5mph. My first attempt to get up I went into the classic "lean back and carve the heel edge" stance - which on a foil produces an immediate launch up and off the board ... ? ? ? Okay, so lesson learned. By attempt #3 I had reprogrammed myself to put weight on the front of the board once you get up from a deep water start.

Once stable on the board without using the foil, it was now time to get it to fly... that is the craziest sensation and adds a full new dimension of balance needed. Suddenly the port-starboard axis is incredibly important to keep centered or you'll start some sweet feeling carves (which will immediately then launch you off the board again). I was able to get in some 15 second- 30 second runs on the foil before crashing and any moment in the air was glorious.

A few things I noted:
1) The foil picks up the rolling wake really well and line slack can be felt immediately, even on the second wake of the Yamaha with no ballast.
2) the direct wake of the boat, where all the turbulence and foam is, will kill your lift quickly!
3) I found muscles, particularly in my rear leg, that I had apparently never used before. Foiling wiped me out, energy wise, for the rest of the day!
4) Driver control to help give/take up slack for starting is key. You need slack to get positioned, but then you need it tight to help push the board up on your feet.
5) Once you're flying, it's amazing the kind of wakes you will cut through from other boaters and not feel a damn thing!

Day 2 - Sunday:
With the rope further back I was able to start away from the boat wake. My first run was my best - I was able to fly for a few minutes before nose-diving the board after a breach. My last run was my best height, I was able to take the board all the way to the top for about a minute or so before breaching it again. Again, I was absolutely wiped out from 45 minutes learning the board - so many different muscles than wakeboard and surfing!

Some questions for the foil'ers out there:
1) How do you gauge your height while riding to prevent breaching? Is that just a feeling you get? Is there a way to recover from a breach before going down?
2) Did you guys go directly to a surf rope or stay further out from the boat while learning?
3) What speed are you running at? I tried 11.5 on day two but that seemed to amplify my balance mistakes.
4) Two hands or one hand on the rope? "Rodeo style" seemed like a natural stance to go into, however when I was trying two handed it seemed more stable going up and down.

 

[Nakk]

Thanks to @J-RAD , I received my Slingshot on Friday night as promised! First thing to note, these aren't plug and play devices - there's assembly required, complete with grease and plumbers tape - LOL!

Some questions for the foil'ers out there:
1) How do you gauge your height while riding to prevent breaching? Is that just a feeling you get? Is there a way to recover from a breach before going down?
2) Did you guys go directly to a surf rope or stay further out from the boat while learning?
3) What speed are you running at? I tried 11.5 on day two but that seemed to amplify my balance mistakes.
4) Two hands or one hand on the rope? "Rodeo style" seemed like a natural stance to go into, however when I was trying two handed it seemed more stable going up and down.

Congrats!

For my answers to your questions, bear in mind I learned to foil under a kite, and the learning process may be a bit different behind a boat. TBH, I find foiling behind a boat slightly more difficult than with a kite. OK, that said:

1 & 2: Keeping your eyes on the horizon will help with gauging height, although you have to be aware of the wake/wave too. I'd recommend staying back and out of the wake until you're very stable out in the flat water. It sounds like you're standing a little too forward on the board and therefore have too much weight on your rear foot. Fine tune your stance while learning ride out in the flat water. Feel where your weight is. Your weight should be evenly split between both legs. If it isn't, change your foot position or your mast position. Learn to gauge height in the flat water back away from the boat. Getting away from the boat will help because the water will be flatter and it will be quieter. Back where it's quiet, learn what the wing sounds like before you breach. There's a gurgling sound when your wing is just on the verge of breaching. That sound is easier to hear away from the boat, but once you've tuned into it you should be able to pick it up closer to the boat. That gurgle is your early warning to ease the board down a bit. After you get comfortable and have your stance fine tuned, now you have the skills to progress in the wake.

As far as breaching, a mild breach is recoverable if corrective action is taken when you hear the gurgle. If the wing comes out the front side of the wave, you're going down unless you're Fred Hope!

3: Speed is dependant on weight, wing size and shape and rider style. You just have to find what speed you prefer.

4: Two hands is definitely more stable, one hand is more versatile as it allows you more freedom with your stance.

To avoid "foil bites," any time you are near the foil in the water, pretend to be paralyzed from the waist down. Do everything with your arms until you are in position to bring your feet up to the board. This will save you some nasty cuts and scrapes from kicking the foil.

Time on the water will cure all of your woes! It just takes time to train your muscle memory and height perception. I recommend staying off of any other board until you feel very comfortable on the foil. Going back and forth slows your progression as foiling is so different than any other board.

Have fun!!!

 

[anmut]

Congrats!

For my answers to your questions, bear in mind I learned to foil under a kite, and the learning process may be a bit different behind a boat. TBH, I find foiling behind a boat slightly more difficult than with a kite. OK, that said:

1 & 2: Keeping your eyes on the horizon will help with gauging height, although you have to be aware of the wake/wave too. I'd recommend staying back and out of the wake until you're very stable out in the flat water. It sounds like you're standing a little too forward on the board and therefore have too much weight on your rear foot. Fine tune your stance while learning ride out in the flat water. Feel where your weight is. Your weight should be evenly split between both legs. If it isn't, change your foot position or your mast position. Learn to gauge height in the flat water back away from the boat. Getting away from the boat will help because the water will be flatter and it will be quieter. Back where it's quiet, learn what the wing sounds like before you breach. There's a gurgling sound when your wing is just on the verge of breaching. That sound is easier to hear away from the boat, but once you've tuned into it you should be able to pick it up closer to the boat. That gurgle is your early warning to ease the board down a bit. After you get comfortable and have your stance fine tuned, now you have the skills to progress in the wake.

As far as breaching, a mild breach is recoverable if corrective action is taken when you hear the gurgle. If the wing comes out the front side of the wave, you're going down unless you're Fred Hope!

3: Speed is dependant on weight, wing size and shape and rider style. You just have to find what speed you prefer.

4: Two hands is definitely more stable, one hand is more versatile as it allows you more freedom with your stance.

To avoid "foil bites," any time you are near the foil in the water, pretend to be paralyzed from the waist down. Do everything with your arms until you are in position to bring your feet up to the board. This will save you some nasty cuts and scrapes from kicking the foil.

Time on the water will cure all of your woes! It just takes time to train your muscle memory and height perception. I recommend staying off of any other board until you feel very comfortable on the foil. Going back and forth slows your progression as foiling is so different than any other board.

Have fun!!!

Awesome stuff, thank you!

I'll keep my eye on the horizon more as I get my balance figured out. Re: foot placement, I skipped putting on the front foot "hook" but think I'll try that next time. I might slide the mast slightly further too if that doesn't work because, I think you're right, all the soreness in my back leg is probably due to having to be so off balance when in the air.

Re: foil bites - yes that thing is dangerous AF in the water. A few times coming down I thought I was going to land right on top of the carbon fiber wing, but haven't so far. I am teaching myself to make an X with my arms in front of my face as soon as I start to crash just to avoid tearing off my nose or something...

Interesting thought about listening for the foil - I'll have to tie to ropes together two get away from those noisy engines!

 

[Nakk]

No worries!

I can hear the gurgle even close to the boat, but only because I got tuned in to it in a quieter environment. And yes, the board can be dangerous. I won't foil anymore without a helmet. That and an arm in front of the face should be sufficient in most cases. I always try and kick the board away from me too in a crash, but sometimes a wave brings it right back. My helmet has been hit hard enough that I shudder to think what would have happened had I not been wearing a helmet...

I use the hooks, but they're really only useful for water starting. Once you're on the board they'll just end up in the way once you're used to putting your feet in the right place. I use them because it's hard for me to stay with the board during a start in seas bigger than two or three feet.

 

[AZMark]

Thanks to @J-RAD , I received my Slingshot on Friday night as promised! First thing to note, these aren't plug and play devices - there's assembly required, complete with grease and plumbers tape - LOL!

Day 1 - Saturday:
I had watched a lot of YouTube "how-to's" previously so I was anxious to get out and try it. As advised from videos, I started with a wakeboard rope at it's shortest length and locked the speed in at 10.5mph. My first attempt to get up I went into the classic "lean back and carve the heel edge" stance - which on a foil produces an immediate launch up and off the board ... ? ? ? Okay, so lesson learned. By attempt #3 I had reprogrammed myself to put weight on the front of the board once you get up from a deep water start.

Once stable on the board without using the foil, it was now time to get it to fly... that is the craziest sensation and adds a full new dimension of balance needed. Suddenly the port-starboard axis is incredibly important to keep centered or you'll start some sweet feeling carves (which will immediately then launch you off the board again). I was able to get in some 15 second- 30 second runs on the foil before crashing and any moment in the air was glorious.

A few things I noted:
1) The foil picks up the rolling wake really well and line slack can be felt immediately, even on the second wake of the Yamaha with no ballast.
2) the direct wake of the boat, where all the turbulence and foam is, will kill your lift quickly!
3) I found muscles, particularly in my rear leg, that I had apparently never used before. Foiling wiped me out, energy wise, for the rest of the day!
4) Driver control to help give/take up slack for starting is key. You need slack to get positioned, but then you need it tight to help push the board up on your feet.
5) Once you're flying, it's amazing the kind of wakes you will cut through from other boaters and not feel a damn thing!

Day 2 - Sunday:
With the rope further back I was able to start away from the boat wake. My first run was my best - I was able to fly for a few minutes before nose-diving the board after a breach. My last run was my best height, I was able to take the board all the way to the top for about a minute or so before breaching it again. Again, I was absolutely wiped out from 45 minutes learning the board - so many different muscles than wakeboard and surfing!

Some questions for the foil'ers out there:
1) How do you gauge your height while riding to prevent breaching? Is that just a feeling you get? Is there a way to recover from a breach before going down?
2) Did you guys go directly to a surf rope or stay further out from the boat while learning?
3) What speed are you running at? I tried 11.5 on day two but that seemed to amplify my balance mistakes.
4) Two hands or one hand on the rope? "Rodeo style" seemed like a natural stance to go into, however when I was trying two handed it seemed more stable going up and down.

View attachment 156027View attachment 156028View attachment 156029

I just listen for the sucking sound just before a breach and you can still save it. Just react smoothly and don’t overcorrect.

I went to the surf rope pretty fast because I was trying to ride the wake, but haven’t gotten there yet. As long as you’re not riding right in the jet bubbles it doesn’t seem any harder.

We try to run 11—13 mph but we don’t have speed control.

 

[AZMark]

Thanks to @J-RAD , I received my Slingshot on Friday night as promised! First thing to note, these aren't plug and play devices - there's assembly required, complete with grease and plumbers tape - LOL!

Day 1 - Saturday:
I had watched a lot of YouTube "how-to's" previously so I was anxious to get out and try it. As advised from videos, I started with a wakeboard rope at it's shortest length and locked the speed in at 10.5mph. My first attempt to get up I went into the classic "lean back and carve the heel edge" stance - which on a foil produces an immediate launch up and off the board ... ? ? ? Okay, so lesson learned. By attempt #3 I had reprogrammed myself to put weight on the front of the board once you get up from a deep water start.

Once stable on the board without using the foil, it was now time to get it to fly... that is the craziest sensation and adds a full new dimension of balance needed. Suddenly the port-starboard axis is incredibly important to keep centered or you'll start some sweet feeling carves (which will immediately then launch you off the board again). I was able to get in some 15 second- 30 second runs on the foil before crashing and any moment in the air was glorious.

A few things I noted:
1) The foil picks up the rolling wake really well and line slack can be felt immediately, even on the second wake of the Yamaha with no ballast.
2) the direct wake of the boat, where all the turbulence and foam is, will kill your lift quickly!
3) I found muscles, particularly in my rear leg, that I had apparently never used before. Foiling wiped me out, energy wise, for the rest of the day!
4) Driver control to help give/take up slack for starting is key. You need slack to get positioned, but then you need it tight to help push the board up on your feet.
5) Once you're flying, it's amazing the kind of wakes you will cut through from other boaters and not feel a damn thing!

Day 2 - Sunday:
With the rope further back I was able to start away from the boat wake. My first run was my best - I was able to fly for a few minutes before nose-diving the board after a breach. My last run was my best height, I was able to take the board all the way to the top for about a minute or so before breaching it again. Again, I was absolutely wiped out from 45 minutes learning the board - so many different muscles than wakeboard and surfing!

Some questions for the foil'ers out there:
1) How do you gauge your height while riding to prevent breaching? Is that just a feeling you get? Is there a way to recover from a breach before going down?
2) Did you guys go directly to a surf rope or stay further out from the boat while learning?
3) What speed are you running at? I tried 11.5 on day two but that seemed to amplify my balance mistakes.
4) Two hands or one hand on the rope? "Rodeo style" seemed like a natural stance to go into, however when I was trying two handed it seemed more stable going up and down.

View attachment 156027View attachment 156028View attachment 156029

And I use one hand to use the other for balance like in your last pic.

 

[spatty99]

1) After a while it becomes intuitive/feel. Although I think you actually can just barely notice the the wing noise/vibration change right before it is going to breach.
2) Longer rope is better, 65' or more. Keeps you further from the wash and wake, which you want to avoid when learning.
3) When I am surfing the first wake I ride at 10.5 mph. For learning on a long line, keep the speeds lower, just fast enough to stay up on the foil. Try around 8 mph and go up from there.
4) 1 hand seems easier to learn balance, and preference after that (and eventually no hands anyway). Using 2 hands can make your hips open up towards the boat, which will add steering input you probably don't want (the same way you teach a wakeboarder to drop their back hand to keep from unwanted edging).