Conversion to LiFePo batteries

[BlueBulls]

The only American made LiFePO4 batteries are Battle Born in Sparks Nevada, entirely made in America.

I didn't spend any time looking at Battle Born after an initial check of their page a few weeks ago because they don't seem to be in the 48v high-current game yet - but they do seem trust-worthy and fairly transparent. Their two main guys are American engineers and their parent company Dragonfly Energy (DFLI) doesn't have any easily found second or third degree foreign connections.

Their SEC filings show that the technical components of their batteries all come from China but at least they do the actual assembly here in the United States:

"Our battery management system is sourced from a single supplier based in China who we have a nearly 10-year relationship with and who manufactures this component exclusively for us based on our proprietary design. Our cells are sourced from two different, carefully selected cell manufacturers in China who are able to meet our demanding quality standards."

Of note, however, is this line:

"As we look toward the production of our solid-state cells, we have signed a non-binding Memorandum of Understanding with a lithium mining company and a lithium recycling company, both located in Nevada for the supply of lithium "

An interesting read, if you're into this kind of thing ?:

https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1847986/000149315223038517/formars.pdf

If I were in the market for their product, though, Battle Born would likely be my choice. Dragonfly Energy is probably not a good investment though.

 

[Bottom Bracket]

My battery search led me to Nextgen Lithium. https://nextgenlithium.com/
Veteran owned, local to me, recommended by the dealer.
The Bluetooth is the bomb

I can monitor the battery real time from the phone.
So far it has performed great! The matching charger brings it to 100% quickly.

 

[OntheWater77]

So after talking to you tonight I wanted to make a few additions to your statements above.

- Voltage of the battery before attempting a full charge on the DL OEM charger: 12.5 V
- Voltage of the battery attempting a full charge on the DL charger: 14.52V
-Voltage of the battery after removing the DL charger: 12.5

To me, this indicates a bad battery. Hopefully armed with that info DL will issue you a RA and packing slip and have you send the battery back for a warranty replacement battery.

After relaying the above readings to the DL customer service tech via email I received return details to ship the DL battery back to Seattle, WA for inspection and potential repair/replacement. Will keep you guys posted on how DL responds further throughout the process.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

After relaying the above readings to the DL customer service tech via email I received return details to ship the DL battery back to Seattle, WA for inspection and potential repair/replacement. Will keep you guys posted on how DL responds further throughout the process.

Thanks for the follow up!

 

[Can0n11]

I have no complaints with the BB batteries. I am using a NOCO 3 bank battery charger and it charges to 100% and the BMS conditions the charge appropriately. In the first pic I had 14.43v on charge and the second was off charge @ 13.41v, within the chart specs for BB posted above. Side note- I have a separate Minnkota charger for the Lead acids in the back. I used a Generac 1600 inverter gen on my 7 day rustic island trip this summer and it could charge both banks concurrently, if memory serves me correct, I was pulling less than 400w per charger. Recharge times were less than 45 min daily on the BB, and the Lead acid House battery took longer to charge.

 

[OntheWater77]

After relaying the above readings to the DL customer service tech via email I received return details to ship the DL battery back to Seattle, WA for inspection and potential repair/replacement. Will keep you guys posted on how DL responds further throughout the process.

Update on my faulty Dakota Lithium battery return / replacement... Once I relayed my multimeter readings to Dakota Lithium customer support I was given instructions to return the battery for further testing, which I did. Once received, DL customer support confirmed the battery was in fact faulty and they replaced it with a new one. Other than the facts that I could not speak with a human in customer service (email only), I had to initially pay for shipping charges (I have been told it will be reimbursed), and I was out of commission for approx 2 weeks waiting for my replacement; I will say that DL did replace their faulty product as advertised in their online warranty claims. I have a total of 4 DL 12V 100Ah lithium batteries and just this one has gone bad, the others appear to be functioning properly. That being said, a 25% failure rate after 2 seasons of weekend warrior level fishing with a couple extended trips mixed in is not good. Maybe I happened to get a random bad battery... Has anyone else had any issues with their DL batteries they can share?

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Update on my faulty Dakota Lithium battery return / replacement... Once I relayed my multimeter readings to Dakota Lithium customer support I was given instructions to return the battery for further testing, which I did. Once received, DL customer support confirmed the battery was in fact faulty and they replaced it with a new one. Other than the facts that I could not speak with a human in customer service (email only), I had to initially pay for shipping charges (I have been told it will be reimbursed), and I was out of commission for approx 2 weeks waiting for my replacement; I will say that DL did replace their faulty product as advertised in their online warranty claims. I have a total of 4 DL 12V 100Ah lithium batteries and just this one has gone bad, the others appear to be functioning properly. That being said, a 25% failure rate after 2 seasons of weekend warrior level fishing with a couple extended trips mixed in is not good. Maybe I happened to get a random bad battery... Has anyone else had any issues with their DL batteries they can share?

Did DL ever reimburse you for the shipping?
Everything back to normal now?

 

[OntheWater77]

DL did reimburse me for shipping, and everything appears to be operating as intended now! I did end up installing the Victron Smart Shunt as well to monitor status going forward as well! Next up on the project list is to get another shunt installed to monitor the house and starting battery. Rigging these properly in conjunction with the DVSR might pose a little tricky... I'll circle back if I run into a snag! Thanks for all the help, much appreciated!

 

[zipper]

I have been watching this refit/rebuild of a catamaran lately...

 

[lazergeek]

I have been watching this refit/rebuild of a catamaran lately...

Zipper, There was another channel that used Tesla Batteries, It was an interesting build. I think its this one.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

That’s next level stuff @zipper @lazergeek !

The first system was awesome at 12.8Kwh! 73% out of a solar system is really good.

The second system was totally awesome at 53KWh in regards to the amount of capacity the Tesla batteries supplied. I would not feel comfortable using NMC batteries in a boat as that chemistry doesn’t play well with water. Beyond that, an incredible amount of storage capacity.



For the kids at home…Always wear the appropriate PPE when doing a project, in both videos none of these guys were wear wearing safety glasses, or were properly clothed. There‘s a tremendous amount of energy in those batteries and just an instant of arc flash in those tight spaces could produce third degree burns (Same with lead acid batteries), the temp of an arc flash is 32,000°F in open air, and 65,000°F in confined spaces. Also do not wear rings or other jewelry that is conductive.

 

[lazergeek]

@FSH 210 Sport I was wanting at one point to do a blue water hybrid electric sailing catamaran. Funny how plans change in 5 years.

 

[Bottom Bracket]

A couple of Tesla batteries in a flooded hold could spin a big wheel...

 

[zipper]

@FSH 210 Sport I was wanting at one point to do a blue water hybrid electric sailing catamaran. Funny how plans change in 5 years.

Wait., what? You are gonna have to go into that a bit deeper. Which catamaran were you going to convert to EV? There is a PDQ 32 on the PDQ group on Facebook that has been partially converted to electric propulsion, using a Torqeedo installed in one hull and a 9.9 Yamaha OB in the other hull. I am sure I/we will be seeing more conversions to electric propulsion in the future. Our PDQ 36 classic currently has (2) 12v 4D AGM batteries and when it is time to replace them, I will be leaning towards Battleborn batteries and a Victron charger/equipment. Will be keeping the Yamaha 9.9's for now.

We lived off the grid from 1995 - 2004 on a 24v system with PV, 800w , wind, 900w and 600ah of storage. Then we ran power lines up to the house and gave the generator a break because the sun does not stay out too long, if at all, during a Vermont Winter.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Wait., what? You are gonna have to go into that a bit deeper. Which catamaran were you going to convert to EV? There is a PDQ 32 on the PDQ group on Facebook that has been partially converted to electric propulsion, using a Torqeedo installed in one hull and a 9.9 Yamaha OB in the other hull. I am sure I/we will be seeing more conversions to electric propulsion in the future. Our PDQ 36 classic currently has (2) 12v 4D AGM batteries and when it is time to replace them, I will be leaning towards Battleborn batteries and a Victron charger/equipment. Will be keeping the Yamaha 9.9's for now.

We lived off the grid from 1995 - 2004 on a 24v system with PV, wind and 600ah of storage. Then we ran power lines up to the house and gave the generator a break because the sun does not stay out too long, if at all, during a Vermont Winter.

The storage capacity of the LFP batteries and their ability to charge so fast is really remarkable. Imagine if you would have had that type of battery from 95-04? You still have to have a genny but you could run it 1/5th of the time.

 

[lazergeek]

Wait., what? You are gonna have to go into that a bit deeper. Which catamaran were you going to convert to EV? There is a PDQ 32 on the PDQ group on Facebook that has been partially converted to electric propulsion, using a Torqeedo installed in one hull and a 9.9 Yamaha OB in the other hull. I am sure I/we will be seeing more conversions to electric propulsion in the future. Our PDQ 36 classic currently has (2) 12v 4D AGM batteries and when it is time to replace them, I will be leaning towards Battleborn batteries and a Victron charger/equipment. Will be keeping the Yamaha 9.9's for now.

We lived off the grid from 1995 - 2004 on a 24v system with PV, 800w , wind, 900w and 600ah of storage. Then we ran power lines up to the house and gave the generator a break because the sun does not stay out too long, if at all, during a Vermont Winter.

We hadnt decided on a certain brand and model yet but had it narrowed down. We were still in the market when I gave up on that plan. But were looking at 40-50 foot range. My wife didnt want to commit to being full time live aboard and shes the princess who wanted to only buy new making it unaffordable at that point. This was kind of my inspiration getting started.

 

[zipper]

Funny, this was my youtub news feed this am. The video's came up just before your post here. Don't ask about the one in the upper right corner...they just like to see what will get your attention, clickbait, not clicking on it, lol.

 

[lazergeek]

Funny, this was my youtub news feed this am. The video's came up just before your post here. Don't ask about the one in the upper right corner...they just like to see what will get your attention, clickbait, not clicking on it, lol.

View attachment 214056

lol, sounds like a nice goal (the video)

Sailing Uma and Bo and Brandi both have DIY Electric sailboats too. Gone with the Winns are just now taking possession of their new HH Hybrid Electric Cat they had built. They had sea trials on there Sunday episode.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

I didn't spend any time looking at Battle Born after an initial check of their page a few weeks ago because they don't seem to be in the 48v high-current game yet - but they do seem trust-worthy and fairly transparent. Their two main guys are American engineers and their parent company Dragonfly Energy (DFLI) doesn't have any easily found second or third degree foreign connections.

Their SEC filings show that the technical components of their batteries all come from China but at least they do the actual assembly here in the United States:

"Our battery management system is sourced from a single supplier based in China who we have a nearly 10-year relationship with and who manufactures this component exclusively for us based on our proprietary design. Our cells are sourced from two different, carefully selected cell manufacturers in China who are able to meet our demanding quality standards."

Of note, however, is this line:

"As we look toward the production of our solid-state cells, we have signed a non-binding Memorandum of Understanding with a lithium mining company and a lithium recycling company, both located in Nevada for the supply of lithium "

An interesting read, if you're into this kind of thing ?:

https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1847986/000149315223038517/formars.pdf

If I were in the market for their product, though, Battle Born would likely be my choice. Dragonfly Energy is probably not a good investment though.

@Bottom Bracket mentioned a while back that BB Aka Dragon fly energy stock was $.50 a share forecasted to go to $9 a share, I bought $2500 worth at $.50 to equal 5000 shares. As of close yesterday Dragon fly closed at $1.42, turning my $2500 investment into $7100. Thanks @Bottom Bracket

 

[Bottom Bracket]

Careful, China's coming out with a "water" battery that stores more energy than lithium.