Guys, what is the max size of Yamaha boat people are towing and launching/retrieving with the BMW X5 ?

[dimbmw]

Can you do it? Sure.

Can you do it safely for your family and others on the road? Doubtful.

Should you do it? It's a free country.

Other things to consider: Laws of physics & the costs of serious injury or death to those around you.

Thats what I am trying to understand…. which laws of physics are being violated here? my X5 weight 5300 lbs, ford f150 truck weights from 4000 lbs to 5700 lbs, so my vehichle is likely heavier, accelerates and breaks way better but yet F150 is better to tow a 25’ boat ?

 

[dimbmw]

I really dislike this manner of recommendations. "Serious injury or death" with this tone implies that it will be instant catastrophe if you tow over any recommended or published limit. It's just a step below the "You'll get sued into oblivion if you tow over the limit and crash". it hyperbole that stems from a misinformation.

I'm not advocating to tow above a published limit, I'm advocating to drop the dumbass scare tactics (and don't act like it's not), and for people to do their own individual risk assessments.

Look at any number of situations and think about how any additional capacity would have helped. Emergency lane change, panic stop from someone pulling out in front of you, or perhaps a failed tow vehicle tire or component. How does the extra safety factor help or hurt. In most cases, the margin is so thin between coming out unscathed and landing in peril that you could easily attribute it to driver experience and attentiveness. Personally, I'll take an alert and competent driver in an overloaded X5, than I would an overconfident new driver in a F350.

@dimbmw your X5 is going to be at or near the limit. I probably wouldn't tow a 25ft boat with that vehicle. Doesn't mean you need to upgrade to get it home, or even to try the first few tows with it. I've towed my 3,200lb AR190 with a Traverse that had a 5,200lb limit and it was absurdly poor experience. I've also towed 7,500-ish lbs of vehicle and trailer behind my Q7 (that's rated for 7,700lbs) and felt like it had WAY more in it resulting in an excellent experience. Point being, evaluate where you're going to be towing, learn the terms of how towing works, and where you stand on those terms, then determine your comfort level with the situation.

Our advice here is worth exactly what you've paid for it, so keep that in mind too.

this is really beyond my comprehension why would Audi Q7 have higher towing capacity than the X5… it is weird imho

 

[HangOutdoors]

Assuming this your post, here be wary of the Facebook goofballs giving poor advice.

Listen, you came here for advice. This is a phenomenal forum and very welcoming. There is a lot of smarts here and tried and true boating and trailering experience. More than I will ever have. Many experienced people who have been towing boats, large animal trailers, heavy equipment and semi's for many, many years gave you advice, it wasn't the advice you wanted to hear. It seems like you were only looking for affirmation that you "Should" do it. Your vehicle is maxed out and then some towing that boat, based on its rating. It is what it is. In the end you will do what you want of course.

I like your SUV and I love the AR250......... I wouldn't put the two together and tow.

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[2kwik4u]

this is really beyond my comprehension why would Audi Q7 have higher towing capacity than the X5… it is weird imho

Lots of reasons. Could be any of these, could be none. Cooling capacity, larger brakes, better dynamic control systems, more intervention from engineering and less from marketing, and 101 other reasons.

I'm unsure if BMW or Audi use SAE J2807. Quick googling shows a '23 X5's can reach 7,250lbs of tow rating. Current generation Q7's are rated at 7,700lbs. Both must be properly equipped to reach the highest rating. Some fullsize trucks aren't rated this high when poorly spec'd. Every configuration will be slightly different.

As to why trucks tow better given similar data points like horsepower, torque, curb weight,etc?!?........it has to do with how they're built. A modern crossover SUV is built more for transporting people than working hard. Trucks will have larger components throughout (like bearings, bushings, control arms, axles, etc) for a given payload. They're made to be beaten on and neglected, so the service factor on almost every component is increased. Beyond that, the longer wheelbase helps stabilize towing dynamics, and the body on frame construction isolates the cabin from vibrations and noise generated while towing. I had a Sierra and it was great, the Q7 is just as good or better, however it clearly won't take the beating as well for as long as the truck did. I also had to modify my hitch setup with the Q7 to eliminate noise and NVH from the towing experience.

I wouldn't tow a 25ft boat with a base model X5. Might consider it with a top trim with tow package, big motor and suspension package. Same with a Q7, wouldn't use the base model without the tow package. Same for a base.model F150, Silverado, or Ram.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

Thats what I am trying to understand…. which laws of physics are being violated here? my X5 weight 5300 lbs, ford f150 truck weights from 4000 lbs to 5700 lbs, so my vehichle is likely heavier, accelerates and breaks way better but yet F150 is better to tow a 25’ boat ?

Dude, do whatever you want to do.

Feel free to ignore all the great advice in this thread and others that you could find in a simple search. It’s asinine to think that the defining factor in tow ability is only the weight of the vehicle. Go back and look at post #16 with the specs for the 2022 F-150. There’s not a huge difference in weigh between the different models, yet there is a big difference in tow capacity for the different versions.

Jim

 

[dimbmw]

Lots of reasons. Could be any of these, could be none. Cooling capacity, larger brakes, better dynamic control systems, more intervention from engineering and less from marketing, and 101 other reasons.

I'm unsure if BMW or Audi use SAE J2807. Quick googling shows a '23 X5's can reach 7,250lbs of tow rating. Current generation Q7's are rated at 7,700lbs. Both must be properly equipped to reach the highest rating. Some fullsize trucks aren't rated this high when poorly spec'd. Every configuration will be slightly different.

As to why trucks tow better given similar data points like horsepower, torque, curb weight,etc?!?........it has to do with how they're built. A modern crossover SUV is built more for transporting people than working hard. Trucks will have larger components throughout (like bearings, bushings, control arms, axles, etc) for a given payload. They're made to be beaten on and neglected, so the service factor on almost every component is increased. Beyond that, the longer wheelbase helps stabilize towing dynamics, and the body on frame construction isolates the cabin from vibrations and noise generated while towing. I had a Sierra and it was great, the Q7 is just as good or better, however it clearly won't take the beating as well for as long as the truck did. I also had to modify my hitch setup with the Q7 to eliminate noise and NVH from the towing experience.

I wouldn't tow a 25ft boat with a base model X5. Might consider it with a top trim with tow package, big motor and suspension package. Same with a Q7, wouldn't use the base model without the tow package. Same for a base.model F150, Silverado, or Ram.

Could you explain what is tow package? I am a newby… my X5 was ordered with a towing hitch socket (with all the electrical connections next to it etc) - is that what you mean?

Wheelbase is same as the Q7, breaks are ///M, engine power is around 500 hp, they are bigger than the breaks on my wife’s Cayenne. Still towing capacity is 5950 lbs… dang it.

By the way does your Q7 have pneumatic suspension? Theoretically should help with leveling?

 

[dimbmw]

Dude, do whatever you want to do.

Feel free to ignore all the great advice in this thread and others that you could find in a simple search. It’s asinine to think that the defining factor in tow ability is only the weight of the vehicle. Go back and look at post #16 with the specs for the 2022 F-150. There’s not a huge difference in weigh between the different models, yet there is a big difference in tow capacity for the different versions.

Jim

I just need to be 100% sure that I am wrong ?

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

Could you explain what is tow package? I am a newby… my X5 was ordered with a towing hitch socket (with all the electrical connections next to it etc) - is that what you mean?

Wheelbase is same as the Q7, breaks are ///M, engine power is around 500 hp, they are bigger than the breaks on my wife’s Cayenne. Still towing capacity is 5950 lbs… dang it.

By the way does your Q7 have pneumatic suspension? Theoretically should help with leveling?

I think you are just trolling us as this point.

Again do whatever you want, I’m sure you intuition is much more reasonable than the numbers that the BMW engineers calculated for your specific vehicle.

Jim

 

[drewkaree]

Wheelbase is same as the Q7, breaks are ///M, engine power is around 500 hp, they are bigger than the breaks on my wife’s Cayenne. Still towing capacity is 5950 lbs… dang it

You realize we can't be used as your defense if or when something goes sideways, yes? "Those guys said I might be able to", or "They never said definitively that I couldn't" doesn't hold legal sway.

You verified my intuition. Do NOT do this. Beyond this, I'm inclined to agree with @Jim_in_Delaware about trolling - you aren't looking at the "why" here, you're looking for someone to give you a "sure, because". You're at least lending credence to my guesstimate that you'll be a danger on the road, and your evaluation skills are seeming to look for affirmative answers to your questions, regardless of the danger to others on the road.

If you're not trolling, state where you are located.

You will be a liability on the road - at the least. You may need someone's help if or when this goes sideways, and even with your outlook, someone here will STILL likely be willing to help you out of the predicament you get yourself/others into.

 

[AZMark]

Could you explain what is tow package? I am a newby… my X5 was ordered with a towing hitch socket (with all the electrical connections next to it etc) - is that what you mean?

Wheelbase is same as the Q7, breaks are ///M, engine power is around 500 hp, they are bigger than the breaks on my wife’s Cayenne. Still towing capacity is 5950 lbs… dang it.

By the way does your Q7 have pneumatic suspension? Theoretically should help with leveling?

If you have 500hp then you probably have some performance version that isn’t suited to towing because of gearing and suspension.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

I know it sounds dumb as F150 and similar would do better, but it is what it is and I am not planning to buy another vehichle....

I am looking at 252 boat... won't it too big/heavy for the bmw X5 (tow capacity 5952 lbs, tongue weight 551 lbs)

Is it too much ? Maybe someone has pictures of someone doing it?

Thanks

It doesn’t sound dumb, it IS dumb..

Momma says stupid is as stupid does.
Forest Gump

Lots of good folks here have tried their best, with only the best of intentions to educate and deter you from doing this, but based on your fb post, and now that I look at it again the first sentence of your post, you’re going to do it anyway, you have wasted your time and the time of these good folks here on this site.

I find it telling that you didn‘t respond to my post about what’s in your manual, better RTFM.

I will offer up this final warning to you and perhaps it will sink in as it involves your bank account and your freedom, E.G. not being incarcerated. If you do this and if there is an accident your insurance company is completely off the hook because you will be guilty of willfully exceeding (feigning ignorance won’t save you) the tow limitations of your vehicle. If someone dies, other than you obviously, as a result of your actions you will be found criminally negligent and you will most likely serve a stint in the grey bar motel, and you will probably be sued for wrongful death by the deceased‘s family, and they will win, because, you will have been criminally negligent, and you will be financially wiped out as none of your insurance will protect you from willful negligence. So, your life as you know it now will be gone forever. Oh, if there’s even low grade moron on the staff of the prosecuting attorneys they’ll trace down your social media accounts and find this thread as more damming evidence. Catch 22, Aka you painted yourself into a corner.

Do yourself and other drivers on the road a favor, check your ego and trust the professional engineers who built, tested and rated your vehicle for its capabilities and limitations.

Either get a smaller boat or get a bigger tow vehicle.

 

[zipper]

I changed my mind...go for it! Just let us know how it goes if you can. Here is a picture of an sx240 at rest. Towing pictures



But a 252 can weigh up to 1000#'s more than this boat, dry. https://jetboaters.net/threads/252sd-vs-ar210-vs-ar240-boattest.30431/

When you go for it...remember this guy.



Good luck to you!

 

[drewkaree]

Towing pictures

There's some gold in that link!

 

[2kwik4u]

Could you explain what is tow package? I am a newby… my X5 was ordered with a towing hitch socket (with all the electrical connections next to it etc) - is that what you mean?

Wheelbase is same as the Q7, breaks are ///M, engine power is around 500 hp, they are bigger than the breaks on my wife’s Cayenne. Still towing capacity is 5950 lbs… dang it.

By the way does your Q7 have pneumatic suspension? Theoretically should help with leveling?

My Q7 does have the air suspension, some don't. It's part of the active suspension package (as well as 4WS, adjustable dampers, and some.other bits)

Towing package varies by manufacturer. Some it's just the hitch attached to the back and some wiring. For others it also includes upgraded coolers, increased axle sizing, different springs and suspension components. Would have to dig into BMW spec sheets to know for certain.

 

[anmut]

Thats what I am trying to understand…. which laws of physics are being violated here? my X5 weight 5300 lbs, ford f150 truck weights from 4000 lbs to 5700 lbs, so my vehichle is likely heavier, accelerates and breaks way better but yet F150 is better to tow a 25’ boat ?

Something that's rarely considered but should be is rear suspension. Your X5 is (guessing) built with independent rear suspension in the back vs. a solid axle on a half-ton truck. This can create considerable more sag, which alters your tongue weight, which impacts your tow load. IRS also adds more side-to-side "twisting" in cross winds.

I'm not saying you can't, or even shouldn't, I'm just saying do your homework first - which seems to be the case here.

 

[2kwik4u]

Checked out that towing thread. These were a few pages deep.

BMW X5 and X6 Forum (F15/F16) - View Single Post - Towing pictures <--Looks like a 242 Limited there. Poster says it's 5,500lbs.

BMW X5 and X6 Forum (F15/F16) - View Single Post - Towing pictures <--That one is definitely over 6k lbs.

BMW X5 and X6 Forum (F15/F16) - View Single Post - Towing pictures <--There's another Yamaha. Best I can tell this is a 21ft, but could be wrong.

BMW X5 and X6 Forum (F15/F16) - View Single Post - Towing pictures <--242 limited S being towed here.

There is certainly a lot of evidence to support it's possible. Be interesting to get year and options on @dimbmw X5. Curious if it's a current model or older generation, and what options it has. Doing some googling I can't find any model rated at 5,250lbs so I'm really interested to see where that number came from.

 

[2kwik4u]

If you do this and if there is an accident your insurance company is completely off the hook because you will be guilty of willfully exceeding (feigning ignorance won’t save you) the tow limitations of your vehicle. If someone dies, other than you obviously, as a result of your actions you will be found criminally negligent and you will most likely serve a stint in the grey bar motel, and you will probably be sued for wrongful death by the deceased‘s family, and they will win, because, you will have been criminally negligent, and you will be financially wiped out as none of your insurance will protect you from willful negligence.

I want to see one example of this. Just one. I'll wait. This rhetoric is exceptionally common and I've yet to see/hear/read anything other than conjecture. It's another example of verbiage that might be prudent for this person, but is largely grounded in "I heard someone else say it once, and it kinda makes sense so I'm going to repeat it" as best I can tell.

I found this quote a while back......It's very prudent in this conversation "Towing over legal DOT weights is illegal. Towing over manufacturer warranty, or recommended capacities is not. Always have to remember. Manufacturers do not write law. "

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

Just because one can do something doesn’t mean that they should.

While it’s true that manufacture towing capacities are recommendations (have any states codified them into law?), I still think they have value as they are not numbers plucked out of the air they are engineered for that specific vehicle. If one is doing any long haul (including the OP’s 100 mile trip) on a routine basis, it likely won’t be great for the tow vehicle and may be a real shitty tow.

I don’t see it being out of the realm of possibility that one could be found negligent for the aftermath of an accident from an overweight tow. It would of course depend on other mitigating factors as well. Regarding payment by insurance companies, I’m not sure that really means anything as their decision to pay is based on the financial outcome for themselves.

Jim

 

[anmut]

I want to see one example of this. Just one. I'll wait. This rhetoric is exceptionally common and I've yet to see/hear/read anything other than conjecture. It's another example of verbiage that might be prudent for this person, but is largely grounded in "I heard someone else say it once, and it kinda makes sense so I'm going to repeat it" as best I can tell.

I found this quote a while back......It's very prudent in this conversation "Towing over legal DOT weights is illegal. Towing over manufacturer warranty, or recommended capacities is not. Always have to remember. Manufacturers do not write law. "

I agree - usually in any FB post when a "can i tow with this vehicle" is asked, this answer is the most common given. That stated, I don't remember any actual stories of an insurance company denying coverage.

Like anything, best to error on the side of caution. Towing can be dangerous to the tow vehicle and those around it. If a person has to ask the "should I be towing with this vehicle" question, it tells me right away that they lack the ability to do their own research aka probably being someone I don't want to be driving next to on a highway with my family. I think a lot of people feel that way, so we relay this negative, but possibly false, narrative in hopes that the person wises up.

 

[HangOutdoors]

I want to see one example of this. Just one. I'll wait. This rhetoric is exceptionally common and I've yet to see/hear/read anything other than conjecture. It's another example of verbiage that might be prudent for this person, but is largely grounded in "I heard someone else say it once, and it kinda makes sense so I'm going to repeat it" as best I can tell.

I found this quote a while back......It's very prudent in this conversation "Towing over legal DOT weights is illegal. Towing over manufacturer warranty, or recommended capacities is not. Always have to remember. Manufacturers do not write law. "

My law firm/attorneys will work that angle and have successfully in civil suits when towing, boats, equipment, towing cars, etc. They advised me not to do it and do so at my own potential risk, when I brought up the topic when I was buying my boat and again last year when I spoke with them, when trying to figure out if I could swap out into an explorer for the Mrs., since her Acadia can't tow shit And use the Explorer if we needed to in case the Expedition wasn't available or if I bought an F-150 and needed to take more than 5 people.

I have great insurance coverage, BUT, i was counseled that an insurance company will try and find every angle they can not to pay out or minimize their total exposure. After that it is on me, my counsel and my dime. I don't plan on giving any excuse to anyone to go down this path.

Each to their own. If people don't want to believe it, or think it is right........ That is fine. Speak with your own attorney's is the best way to approach it and take their advice..... Since if they indicate it is cool to do, they will be defending you if the situation arises anyhow and you would have recourse on them. If they do say dont' worry about it...... Have them put it in writing so you have that for your records...... I am fairly certain they won't.