2019 Release coming soon!

[BigN8]

I was the one that said that. There are shifts all the time. There use to be no jetboats. Now how many models and brands are there? People use to waterski, when was the last time you saw that being done? Then hyroslide. Then wakeboarding where it was about the wake being higher further back for jumping and flips. Then lots of tubing. Now it's wakesurfing where they want the huge wave right there. Pontoons use to be cheap junk, now there's a market for 100k gofast luxury pontoon boats. Now bay boats are huge and into the 6 digits. 23' boats use to not ever have a head, that I remember, now a lot do. Now some bowriders are starting to go with that left aisle instead of center aisle and putting a small sleeper cabin in the combined space. I can't remember a single outboard before that had a transom design like the new Searays and Monterys. There is change everywhere and all the time. Sorry, but in the boat department, there has literally been no innovation from Yamaha in over 10yrs. Oh wait, my bad, sorry, they did invent the 'articulating keel'. All I see is them trying to fix the things people don't like (steering, reverse, throttle) and raising the price absurbly for the same basic boat. Oh, and trying to not loose sales to the 'wakesurfing' crowd. Are they making their boats even better? Of course, YES! But the price increases are out of whack.

When I look at what seriously is different between my AR230 and a new AR240, sorry, it's almost nothing. The layout is basically the same. Sure the outward appearance is different, bow is squared off, the rear transom is lower, different engines, different electronics, etc. I don't know how to explain it, but while the two are different, uuhh, they're also not really different. For that stuff that I consider important, literally nothing is different. For somebody that does not currently own a Yamaha, sure, it all helps make the boat that much more appealing (except the price). In 11yrs, the single only thing they've added that I really want is the smooth throttle control. They haven't even solved the grass issue. Would I love my seats to be hinged? Of course! Side table mounts, check!

Now compare what searay and monterey did. They still offer the traditional bowrider with the traditional layout, but now they've introduced new layouts that are quite different and are pulling me and others back away from Yamaha and actually considering going back to prop. I've been jetboating for over 18yrs now, had a seadoo before, but I've never really been about prop vs jet. Yes, jet is safer, no exposed props for the kids, I did enjoy that when my kids were very little but seriously, let's stop BSing ourselves, most did it cause the Yamaha was cheaper, but nobody wants to really admit that. Sounds much better to say I got it cause jets are safer. Yes, one 'can' wakesurf behind a jet and not a prop, but I don't use our boat for wakesurfing at all. If you're super serious above wakesurfing, stop looking at Yamahas and get a real wakesurf boat. For me, it's been about the price and layout. Jet's had for a long time just been cheaper and I also happened to like and then even love their layouts. Well, the prop crowd is waking up and starting to give us the layouts, and Yamaha is helping them out a lot too by #@#@ing up their own pricing.

Just doing a quick search, my 2007 AR230 MSRP was $38k. The new AR240 is $57k. Sure, 11yrs have passed. Then again compare a 2007 Waverunner FX HO at $10.5k and a new FX HO at $13.5k. Hmm, the boats have increased 50% in price, but the waverunner only went up 28%. No doubt, the AR240 would be that much more attractive at 48k instead of 57k. And then when I look at base vs e-series or X, I feel like I'm getting charged yet another extra $20k for about $5k worth of stuff (but all brands are guilty of this). The difference though is the other brands tend to offer alacarte so I only get robbed on exactly what extra I want vs having no choice and getting robbed on all of it.

Yamaha has now easily priced their boats to the point that it's a no brainer to cross shop and look at other boats.

You price comparison of Yamaha boats to Yamaha skis over a 10 year period is missing one crucial factor. Capitalism... Yamaha has cornered the market on jet boats. They have not done that with skis. Seadoo holds a strong share of the PWC market. You can bet your bottom dollar some smart mofo's at the Yamaha mothership did some serious market analysis to come up with these prices, and that is driven by the economy and demand for these boats. So buy or don't buy, the fact remains these boats will continue to go up in price, until the next recession and the boat market collapses.

 

[ptwb]

No idea if this link is right and it only goes to 2014, but if it's right, it's basically saying 2014 JETBOAT sales are half what they were in 2007 (when the 230 model was boat of the year). Seadoo stopped boats in 2012, Chaparral did not introduce till the end of 14 or maybe even 15 and Scarab did not come out till 15.

Maybe they are raising prices because they are not selling anywhere as many?

https://www.statista.com/statistics/215501/total-jet-boat-units-sold-in-the-us/

 

[BigN8]

No idea if this link is right and it only goes to 2014, but if it's right, it's basically saying 2014 JETBOAT sales are half what they were in 2007 (when the 230 model was boat of the year). Seadoo stopped boats in 2012, Chaparral did not introduce till the end of 14 or maybe even 15 and Scarab did not come out till 15.

Maybe they are raising prices because they are not selling anywhere as many?

https://www.statista.com/statistics/215501/total-jet-boat-units-sold-in-the-us/

Going out to my local lake and seeing all the Yamaha jet boats running around tells me that there has been no decline in sales. But whatever dude...

 

[ptwb]

I don't know what to say. I see Yamahas, but here in FL, the top boating market, I also see Chaparral and Scarab jets too.

I found more news indicating that jetboat sales (and all boat sales in general) started increasing after the 2014 low and by 2016, jetboats were back up to 4721 sales. At that point, there were now multiple jetboat brands to choose from.

 

[Julian]

I wouldn't say that. The 240 is only a foot longer. The 230 is closer to the 240 than a 210 No doubt the bow is a larger area because of the shape, but still only designed for 2 people comfortably at speed. While the 230 is rated for 10 and the 240 is rated for 12, the only way I see getting to 12 is have 4 people in the front or 2 people always riding on the transom or people are just uncomfortable in the middle. I've been on test rides with 8 people in the main area and no thanks, somebody eventually ends up moving to the front.

LOL, if anything, my 230 is more comfortable for 8 people in the main area than the 240 because of my passenger side flip seat instead of the space wasting captains chair. My 230 boat can sit two people in that space instead of the 1 on the 240.


View attachment 82046

Guess I should have specified when I said "older 23' boats" - 2003-2006 23' boats. The 2007 plus boats definitely made better use of the space.

 

[JohnM]

Let me ask this question in regards to the statements that the Yamaha’s are not as good of a value as they where in the past. What other boat can be had for say under $70k that compares to the options of the 242 limited se?

I’m shopping for a boat that can comfortably seat 10, can perform water sports well (not interested in surfing), fun to drive, looks great and has some tech like a decent screen and preferably e-throttles. I keep circling back to the ar240 or the 242 limited se if I can afford it. My other option is a chaparral 223 vrx built to my liking for around $60k. I can’t find other brands that offer what Yamaha does in size and options in this price range.

 

[ACrews]

Let me ask this question in regards to the statements that the Yamaha’s are not as good of a value as they where in the past. What other boat can be had for say under $70k that compares to the options of the 242 limited se?

I’m shopping for a boat that can comfortably seat 10, can perform water sports well (not interested in surfing), fun to drive, looks great and has some tech like a decent screen and preferably e-throttles. I keep circling back to the ar240 or the 242 limited se if I can afford it. My other option is a chaparral 223 vrx built to my liking for around $60k. I can’t find other brands that offer what Yamaha does in size and options in this price range.

There are lots of options in that price range. Just for example, the Sea Ray 23 Spx is rated for 13 people. Available in sterndrive & outboard model. Most all options can be added individually. Has glass dash/built in gps option, full drive by wire engine options, etc. Can be found in the high $50s to mid $60k depending on options & upward from there.

There is a lot of negotiating that can be done on almost all brands of boats. There isn't as much wiggle room on a Yamaha. If you get them to drop 3-4k on a Yamaha you'd be doing good.

I'm still a Yamaha fan, but there are lots of options. This is only one. Happy hunting.

 

[ripler]

But even the Malibu Wakesetter mentioned earlier at 79K is an interesting example. It doesn't come with a trailer - add 2.5k for that ($81,500) and then compare it to the 21' Yamaha 212X at $61K, and you still have a $20,000 delta.

The Malibu that I mentioned earlier does come with a trailer. I was really looking into this boat last year, but we changed out minds. Malibu introduce this boat in 2017 and they didn't increase the price in 2018.

Directly from the Malibu website.

Priced at just $79,995, the traditional bow 21 VLX crossover seats up to 13 and comes equipped with Integrated Surf Platform™, G3.5 tower with speakers and board racks, Viper II Command Center, matching custom trailer, bimini top and canvas cover. Choose between the Diamond Multisport Hull or the Wake Plus Hull for wake and surf specialization.

In the 21' range there are plenty of options for a true wake boat that are very comparable to the 212X and don't forget that the Yamaha will need some additions to make it suitable for surfing.

With the X series, Yamaha is trying to get into a market that they shouldn't be.

 

[zipper]

No idea if this link is right and it only goes to 2014, but if it's right, it's basically saying 2014 JETBOAT sales are half what they were in 2007 (when the 230 model was boat of the year). Seadoo stopped boats in 2012, Chaparral did not introduce till the end of 14 or maybe even 15 and Scarab did not come out till 15.

Guess I should have specified when I said "older 23' boats" - 2003-2006 23' boats. The 2007 plus boats definitely made better use of the space.

There are lots of options in that price range. Just for example, the Sea Ray 23 Spx is rated for 13 people. Available in sterndrive & outboard model. Most all options can be added individually. Has glass dash/built in gps option, full drive by wire engine options, etc. Can be found in the high $50s to mid $60k depending on options & upward from there.

There is a lot of negotiating that can be done on almost all brands of boats. There isn't as much wiggle room on a Yamaha. If you get them to drop 3-4k on a Yamaha you'd be doing good.

I'm still a Yamaha fan, but there are lots of options. This is only one. Happy hunting.

Not at all trying to hijack the thread, but after reading some of the posts, I feel we made the right decision and bought (2) boats for under $60k. And feel that we have the best of both worlds. The 07 Ar230 has been a great boat for us. We love that boat. Paid 21k in 2016. And in this thread, https://jetboaters.net/threads/we-have-been-looking-to-add-to-our-boating-options.15561/page-7#post-332491, we found our 1991 Beneteau 35s5. This boat is a blast to sail. Paid 38k in May. Now we have spent mod $$ on both so 70k is more likely what we spent. The Yamaha is great for what we ask of her, quick trips to the beach in knee deep water, hanging out and having lunch, water sports etc. And the Beneteau is great when the wind picks up and conditions become uncomfortable for the Yamaha, she is a lot of fun in 10-20kt winds. I know older boats are not for everyone, but these two filled a void for us.

 

[Julian]

The Malibu that I mentioned earlier does come with a trailer. I was really looking into this boat last year, but we changed out minds. Malibu introduce this boat in 2017 and they didn't increase the price in 2018.

Directly from the Malibu website.

Priced at just $79,995, the traditional bow 21 VLX crossover seats up to 13 and comes equipped with Integrated Surf Platform™, G3.5 tower with speakers and board racks, Viper II Command Center, matching custom trailer, bimini top and canvas cover. Choose between the Diamond Multisport Hull or the Wake Plus Hull for wake and surf specialization.

In the 21' range there are plenty of options for a true wake boat that are very comparable to the 212X and don't forget that the Yamaha will need some additions to make it suitable for surfing.

With the X series, Yamaha is trying to get into a market that they shouldn't be.

I'm not arguing that the Yamaha makes a good surf platform. I'm just pointing out that when people compare the 24' 242X to a 21' in terms of price, that isn't fair. Compare the same size boat. My point still stands....its 19k difference.....if you seek a versatile boat that you can make surf for 3k, then this is a MUCH cheaper option than the Malibu....MUCH cheaper. And many (myself included) would say that the Yamaha layout is still preferable over the Malibu, and when boating on lakes with shallow areas.....I'd hate to have all that gear below the boat!

 

[swatski]

The Malibu that I mentioned earlier does come with a trailer. I was really looking into this boat last year, but we changed out minds. Malibu introduce this boat in 2017 and they didn't increase the price in 2018.

Directly from the Malibu website.

Priced at just $79,995, the traditional bow 21 VLX crossover seats up to 13 and comes equipped with Integrated Surf Platform™, G3.5 tower with speakers and board racks, Viper II Command Center, matching custom trailer, bimini top and canvas cover. Choose between the Diamond Multisport Hull or the Wake Plus Hull for wake and surf specialization.

In the 21' range there are plenty of options for a true wake boat that are very comparable to the 212X and don't forget that the Yamaha will need some additions to make it suitable for surfing.

With the X series, Yamaha is trying to get into a market that they shouldn't be.

One of our boating friends got a brand new 2017 MasterCraft NXT 22 for 65k, in 2018. That was about 10k discount so even without a discount - the 242X is now in the MC territory... And yes, the 22 NXT is way way bigger inside than a 24ft yammie, even though the bow area is smaller.

I'm happy with my purchase, after customizing my 50k yamaha to a total cost of (...$$$). However, my circumstances are notable by shallow water. If I had access to deep water 100% of the time, like I will when we move, there is no way in hell I would be buying a 70k+ yamaha jet boat.

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[ptwb]

For those interested in wakesurfing, a friend of mine has an Axis A24. 24.5' Starts in the $70s.

The Yamaha 240x you can add 1400lbs of ballast. The A24, almost twice as much, 3750lbs. The Yamaha has the better OVERALL layout, but for wakesurfing, it's not. Most wakesurf boats do not have a passenger captain's chair. Yes, I know, you can swivel the chair on the Yamaha, but it's still a space waster. The Yamaha is rated for 12 people which I think is unrealistic. The axis is rated for, .... 17 people. Now we've never had 17 on it, but i can say the interior is much roomier. On the axis, we push a button and stuff starts moving at the back and we can switch from left to right easily. Nothing needs to be pulled out of storage and mounted or flipped. The Yamaha is just not as easy. It's not hard, but it's also not as easy as pushing a button. If you've regularly got a mix of people that want different sides, it's going to get old quick on the Yamaha (or any other jetboat flipping stuff from side to side).

But in the case of wakesurf boats, you shouldn't necessary compare by length as a 21' wakesurf boat can have the person capacity of the 24' Yamaha boat and that opens up cheaper boats.

And like was said earlier, other brands it's easier to haggle down the price.

For those that are serious about wakesurfing or just wakesurf a lot, the Yamaha is just not really a wakesurfing boat. Can one wakesurf behind a Yamaha, sure. But please, let's get serious and stop comparing to dedicated wake surf boats. I can mount 30 rodholders if I wanted on my boat, heck, even some outriggers, but that would not make it a serious offshore fishing boat.

If you want to do a lot of DIFFERENT things, go to the beach, sandbar, waves, shallow water, rough water, faster than 40, snorkelling in the keys, bimini, etc, the Yamaha is the clear winner (or other prop bowriders, too).

If you live on a lake and wakesurf, get a wakesurf boat. And if you can't afford it new, get a used one. Hands down, a used wakesurf boat is going to be more fun than a new Yamaha at the lake.

 

[Whisky]

This is such a tough discussion, we LOVE our Yamaha, it's versatile and does everything we want. When we upgraded, surfability was a big topic, but it wasn't the ONLY topic and because of that we went this route.

Stock, we are having a blast learning to surf and plan to mod over the winter (WakeBooster here we come) but we are also enjoying every other activity that these boats excel at too! Maybe one day we will upgrade to a surf dedicated rig, but for now we have our 212X and it does everything we need well enough that we aren't looking at the next boat in line at the launch with any envy.

 

[swatski]

This is such a tough discussion, we LOVE our Yamaha, it's versatile and does everything we want. When we upgraded, surfability was a big topic, but it wasn't the ONLY topic and because of that we went this route.

Stock, we are having a blast learning to surf and plan to mod over the winter (WakeBooster here we come) but we are also enjoying every other activity that these boats excel at too! Maybe one day we will upgrade to a surf dedicated rig, but for now we have our 212X and it does everything we need well enough that we aren't looking at the next boat in line at the launch with any envy.

I agree!
I have always said these are the real Swiss Army Knives of Boats!

And quite honestly, if Yamaha paid more attention to QC and NVH standards (and made those boats nicer and quieter out of the factory) - I would probably pay the money, again.

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[DavisAR195]

One thing I love about my Yamaha is passing those 100k plus wake boats going 50 mph.

 

[AG in the LC]

New to jet boats. Looking at getting my first in the spring. When does Scarab tend to show off their new offerings ?

 

[haknslash]

One thing I love about my Yamaha is passing those 100k plus wake boats going 50 mph.

You must boat in a lake with zero traffic. I say that because in chop during peak boating season these 19' boats get tossed like a washing machine and are not comfortable to drive at high speeds. I spend most of my time around 25 mph if conditions are kind of rough. When it gets real rough I will go much slower. That's when I get passed by wake and pontoon boats because they can cut through chop better than my lightweight boat could dream of.

Money does not equate to top speed. You can spend 100k on a pontoon these days and not hit over 40 mph. It's not all about top speed and if it were we'd be talking about BRP powered boats than Yamaha since they own the top speed performance for a twin engine jet boat.

 

[jEt_jAk]

Before my AR195 I had a Scarab 165, compared to the Scarab the AR195 is smooth as glass The Scarab would literally go airborne at 40MPH+ with chop!

 

[haknslash]

Well of course it is. The 165 is like a bathtub with a motor lol

 

[Julian]

It's not all about top speed and if it were we'd be talking about BRP powered boats than Yamaha since they own the top speed performance for a twin engine jet boat.

I agree top speed is not all it's about. That said, brp HP ratings are not the only story... Many brp boats with way more hp go the same or slower than their Yamaha counterparts.