Broken off Spark Plug into cylinder head

[lazergeek]

You will also need new head bolts as they are stretched, it's either torque then stretch or stretch then torque. I don't remember but the manual specifies. Thats why I just let the dealer deal with mine

 

[Fish for Dinner]

Regardless if I drove around for a year with fishing line, that wasn’t the problem. In fact it had nothing to do with the misfiring Mr. Know it all. Try be more supportive and helpful instead being a smartass.

 

[Scottintexas]

Why are people using torque wrenches on spark plugs?? They are suppose to barely be hand tightened. This is one of the reasons why they break when changing them.

my manual gives a tightening torque value, how do you know you tighten it correctly if you don't use a torque wrench ?

 

[Fish for Dinner]

You will also need new head bolts as they are stretched, it's either torque then stretch or stretch then torque. I don't remember but the manual specifies. Thats why I just let the dealer deal with mine

Yes I’m aware of the bolts. I ordered those as well. My plan is to remove the head and then take it to the dealer to remove the broken spark plug. They told me if I have them do it, it will be about $2200 at $159/hr. He told me he will put a tech on it who will take his time or I can do it which will take about 6 hours and bring it in afterwards to remove the broken spark plug and possibly rethread.

 

[Fish for Dinner]

my manual gives a tightening torque value, how do you know you tighten it correctly if you don't use a torque wrench I’m just saying,


View attachment 220455

my manual gives a tightening torque value, how do you know you tighten it correctly if you don't use a torque wrench ?




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When I removed the other 5, they were not torqued at all. They were barely hand tightened with maybe a half turn which I think it should be. They removed effortlessly. I don’t think the specs on this issue account for the water that sits in the exhaust manifold which potentiates rust over time. If it’s torqued too much, the rust will cause a problem inside the threads.

 

[drewkaree]

Why are people using torque wrenches on spark plugs?? They are suppose to barely be hand tightened. This is one of the reasons why they break when changing them.

You should see what the service manual has to say about that. You'd be surprised how varied "hand tight" is, as a numerical value, and how much more consistent a torque wrench is.

@adrianp89 is right, it's hard to take your mechanical advice seriously when you won't remove braided line from your impeller because you didn't know how.

1st class troll job there.

 

[Fish for Dinner]

If you look back at my thread, I didnt say I didn’t know how to remove the fishing line. I said I didn’t k ow how to remove the jet pump at the time. I’m not here to argue or go back and forth. I’m simply saying if the torque spec is correct, then the manufacturer/tech did not torque these 5 out of 6 plugs at all because I did not have to apply any force at all to remove them. If the manufacturer don’t follow their own specs, how do we know if the service manual is legit enough for us to follow?

 

[Scottintexas]

Yes it was cylinder #1. I do believe it was cross threaded. There’s no way it should have been as torqued as it was. The others came out effortlessly.

I don’t think the specs on this issue account for the water that sits in the exhaust manifold which potentiates rust over time. If it’s torqued too much, the rust will cause a problem inside the threads.

But your problem is a cross threaded plug not a rusty seized plug,

if your plug was cross threaded I wouldn't be surprised it was harder to remove or installed at an angle and you thinking you are straight on the plug with the socket but are actually applying a side ways force causing the plug to snap,

If the manufacturer don’t follow their own specs, how do we know if the service manual is legit enough for us to follow?

I'm going to not even respond about the fishing line/jet pump,

The mfg made a mistake and cross threaded your spark plug and now you can't trust the service manual for torque values,

you realize that is just a ridiculous position,

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

People it's your boat do as you like I use never seize, I know why the end of the plugs get corroded and I know how to remove a stuck plug and how to avoid it in the first place. how to avoid damaging the intermediate bearing housing and how to tighten a plug with never seize on it.
I have also learned too many cooks spoil the soup and my favorite I know that jet boats can out handle a prop boat. So Every year we get a new class of what ever year it is and we go over the same things. Do a little research on this web site and if you seek you shall find. And in my humble opinion I have not agreed with many things that some boat manufacturers have told people. Now they cut way back on the time frame for greasing the intermediate bearings and they changed to nylon pump liners etc etc etc they even added a rudder to some of their boats so maybe they are also reading some of the info on here oh and I nearly forgot the quality control often speaks volumes. Oh and I NEVER rev up an engine with all these valves when it has no load on it sitting out of the water on a trailer or lift.

 

[drewkaree]

Previous owner used it on old plugs. I put in new plugs without any seize, put torque wrench to spec, snapped it before even close to clicking.

I'm having a hard time parsing this. Are you saying the old anti-seize caused the new plug to break, as it was being installed?

Or is there a spellcheck change there, where you said "without any size, and put torque..." and it swapped "anti" for "any"?

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

FWIW,

I’ve been using the copper based anti seize on bolts since I was a kid, been torquing bolts with said anti seize on said bolts that either went into steel or aluminum with the same 1/2” drive Proto torque wrench my Dad gave me when I was 15 years old, that wrench has never been dropped, or left with a torque number dialed into it, and have torqued bolts with as little as 5# on up to 150# which is its rating, I use a 1/4” drive 160 INCH pound torque wrench, up to 13 fl lb when working with smaller fasteners, it is interesting that the spark plugs come tight and the torque wrench clicks right at about a 1/2 turn after the crush washer contacts the plug seat. Also as a FYI, crush washers are a single use item, or in an emergency can be used over then replaced as soon as practical.

So, if one is worried about too much tension applied with a torque wrench with anti seize on the threads of the plug then just use the 1/2 turn method like @Ronnie mentioned once the crush washer comes into contact with the plug seat, and, you will have the spec’d torque per the manual. For use in the marine environment, I will always use either antiseize or thread sealant to make sure nothing corrodes.

And personally, I‘d pay the shop the $2200 to do the job, you will have a warranty on those repairs for a period of time, and if it gets messed up they have to fix it. Also, if you’ve not pulled your pumps it would be a great time to pull them and make sure you have adequate grease in the cones.

Either way, hope you can get it all done and get back on the water ASAP!

 

[Fish for Dinner]

How do you know it was crossthreaded? Youre just making assumptions. I won’t know that until the broken one is removed and and I try to screw the new one in without any force. Do me a favor, if you can’t respond in respectful manner, then I would rather you not respond to me at all.

 

[drewkaree]

In the proper order of sussing out a problem...

Why are people using torque wrenches on spark plugs??

Youre just making assumptions.

When I removed the other 5, they were not torqued at all.

Your troubleshooting has consisted of assumptions about the braided line, a question about the use of torque wrenches (demonstrating a lack of mechanical knowledge, at the very least), an assertion that a guesstimate of "hand tight" is sufficient in spite of an actual, existing, verifiable numerical value to apply for a service item, provided by the manufacturer, chastising people for "making assumptions" while doing exactly that as shown above, and SOMEHOW you expect to be taken seriously, when you go out of your way to avoid, downplay, or contradict the advice given to you, despite your demonstrated lack of mechanical knowledge?

If you're NOT trolling us, perhaps take the plank out of your own eye, and at the very least, stop providing cannon fodder for the sarcasm coming your way.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

How do you know it was crossthreaded? Youre just making assumptions. I won’t know that until the broken one is removed and and I try to screw the new one in without any force. Do me a favor, if you can’t respond in respectful manner, then I would rather you not respond to me at all.

Ummm is that response directed towards me?

 

[Neutron]

Man you guys are rough!
Dad taught me: "if nothing nice to say keep your trap shut!"
Be helpfull, not hurtful, take a breath or beer and get back on the water

 

[adrianp89]

I'm having a hard time parsing this. Are you saying the old anti-seize caused the new plug to break, as it was being installed?

Or is there a spellcheck change there, where you said "without any size, and put torque..." and it swapped "anti" for "any"?

Yes. Some anti-seize stayed in the head when I removed the old. I installed the ones out without wiping it down (lesson learned). Hand tightened new ones then went to finish to torque to spec. Most of the plugs were fine but felt questionable. I think second to last one snapped with almost zero effort, well before point of wrench clicking. Went to harbor freight and got an easy out, took about 10 seconds to get out because it was so lubed up it wasn’t tight at all.

I did this boat again last week and just did 1/4 turn after hand tightening. Now I’m scared of it ?

 

[Neutron]

Yes. Some anti-seize stayed in the head when I removed the old. I installed the ones out without wiping it down (lesson learned). Hand tightened new ones then went to finish to torque to spec. Most of the plugs were fine but felt questionable. I think second to last one snapped with almost zero effort, well before point of wrench clicking. Went to harbor freight and got an easy out, took about 10 seconds to get out because it was so lubed up it wasn’t tight at all.

I did this boat again last week and just did 1/4 turn after hand tightening. Now I’m scared of it ?

I have seen old antiseize that was in high heat areas (like a spark plug) become very crusty, hard, and brittle. Not a fan of using it in certain situations..

 

[drewkaree]

I have seen old antiseize that was in high heat areas (like a spark plug) become very crusty, hard, and brittle. Not a fan of using it in certain situations..

Was that the silver (aluminum?) stuff? I've switched to copper, and a nickel, but admittedly don't have much time on the applications of them for much useful feedback, other than caliper slide pins seem to be less problematic with the nickel anti-seize when removing for inspection

*edited to add*
Just came to mind that I had an EBC brake setup that came with copper anti-seize, but I haven't needed to inspect anything yet

 

[drewkaree]

I wonder if the extension needed is an additional reason for some of the breakage of plugs. Mine needs a 6" extension, and some may not be aware of the side forces being applied.

To avoid cross-threading, a super easy way is to use the extension only, by hand, and turn the plug counter-clockwise until you hear a click. That click is an indicator that it should now be sitting on the threads, and turning it by hand for a few revolutions should give you a feel for proper threading before taking a torque wrench to it to finish the process

 

[drewkaree]

Man you guys are rough!
Dad taught me: "if nothing nice to say keep your trap shut!"
Be helpfull, not hurtful, take a breath or beer and get back on the water

When offering help, going on the information given, and being chastised for responding based on that information, it's reasonable to expect blowback. That past help offered has been ignored only adds to the reaction. To cry poor, and then throw money at a suspected problem only serves to compound the responses. Trying to be helpful has been met with unkind responses as well, or outright ignoring of said help.

If it's raining here, one can only add the beer, which fuels the fire.